Update III: This update is out of order because I wanted to make sure you saw it. When I wrote that Christian parents with kids in public schools had my sympathy, I forgot to add this: And my prayers! God may have appointed you as his tool for fixing the government schools. In fact, while listening to a Christian program, I was encouraged by a man who felt led to run for the local school board. He lost, but the next time around, he won. More Christian parents were inspired, so they ran. The school board now has a Christian majority. What prompted him to run in the first place? Homosexuality-is-normal doctrine was being pushed. Please stay and fight if that’s what you believe your Lord and Savior requires of you!
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Morals, schmorals. Cheer up, Democrats! You still run the nation’s government-run schools! Hopefully, Christians and conservatives will continue to flee and opt for homeschooling or private schools for their precious children so you won’t be tainted by the presence of those intolerant, hateful bigots!
The Montgomery County school board voted unanimously to show kids videos of other kids putting condoms on cucumbers.
The Montgomery County (MD) public school system approved a curriculum yesterday in which 10th-graders will be shown how to put condoms on cucumbers, and eighth-graders will learn that homosexual couples are the newest American family.
Said one dissenter:
“We are a Catholic family and feel strongly that the school system has no right or business telling our children that they may be homosexual and that a homosexual orientation is acceptable.”
You lose, religious zealot! Border-line kiddie porn is here to stay.
Liberals and secularists are under the mistaken impression that their indecent dogma is value-neutral and rational while ours (Christians) is theocratic Dark Ages hogwash. Mock God, will you? I wouldn’t do it if I were you.
Let’s hear more about the Democrat-dominated government-run school system:
The condom demonstration is part of a video titled “Protect Yourself” that will be shown this spring to the 10th-graders. In the video, a girl demonstrates how to fit a condom onto a cucumber and talks about the dangers of unprotected sex and cheap condoms that could break.The video also stresses abstinence as the only foolproof way to avoid disease, said David Fishback, chairman of the committee. The video was pilot tested last spring in three high schools.
The board is also considering a second video in which food-flavored condoms are discussed.
What’s this about abstinence? How kind of them to throw us decent folks a bone! And food-flavored condoms? Hey, they’d better not contain sugar. That would really upset liberals.
I will forego the usual commentary and offer you three words: sick, sick and sick. If I couldn’t afford a private school or homeschooling for my as yet unborn children, I’d gather the strength and other Christians to fight this mess until I collapsed from exhaustion.
If you’re a Christian and your kid is in a government school because you have no other choices, you have my sympathy.
Update: Bush did better everywhere in 2004 than he did in 2000.
Update II: Fred Thompson for Attorney General! I hope.
Also, see David Limbaugh’s assessement of condoms and cucumbers in Montgomery County.
See this week’s Carnival of the Vanities.
Re: Uganda’s abstinence program: I forgot about this post. Check it out.
Open seat on the Watcher’s Council!
Some guy named Alberto Gonzales is Bush’s choice for Attorney General.
Why am I not interested in the oil-for-food scandal? Too many other things to write about. JustOneMinute has the latest.
Update IV (11/11): Thank you, commenters, for making this blog an enjoyable read. Many readers cite my posts, but they also like your comments. Your time and thoughtfulness is very much appreciated by this blogger.
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La Shawn Barber has an interesting post about public school sex-ed. Don’t skip the comments…
Nothing new, and sadly, nothing shocking…
Even though I have no kids at this point, it is things like this that make me give serious thought to running for the schoolboard.
One pathetic thing about this, aside from the amorality of forcing this on all the families, regardless of their beliefs, is that if the school really wanted to curb STDs and teen pregnancies, 10th grade is already too late. It is a sad commentary on our society that this is the case, and a good illustration of the bandaid/enablement mentality of much of the left in general and the education establishment in particular.
Join the Paul Revere Society today!!
Visit http://www.michaelsavage.com andclick the link to the Paul Revere Society.
Borders, Language, Culture.
Michael Savage was right. He is right he’s right, 99.98% of the time.
God bless that man and save him, Lord.
Bring Mr. Savage to your Son, Jesus. Amen
I’m sure many Christians are praying for his salvation.
One more reason that the liberals so violently oppose vouchers.
I’m a British Christian who totally deplores this kind of thing in schools. We have it, to a lesser extent, over here as well. What puzzles me about the situation in America is how Christians can rightly protest this kind of secular humanism and then promptly back a regime which espouses an international secular capitalism. We should be following God’s ways, it appears both your parties do a lot that is against His will.
This is why my 11-year-old son goes to a Christian private school, period. My wife and I have talked to him about sex, and how it all works. When he has a question, he comes and asks us, and we give him a straight-forward answer.
So here’s one good kid that doesn’t need to see a film about how to put on a condom, or have a gleeful instructor tell him, “You might be a homosexual!” if he asks a question.
If a teacher displayed a video of Larry the Cucumber from Veggie Tales they would get fired – but place a condom on a cucumber thats called enlightened.
Isn’s this video a form of child abuse? If I invited the neighborhood children to my house to watch such filth, I would be branded and arrested as the local pervert, and rightly so.
Johnny still cant read but he can put a condom on a cucumber what a mess our educational system is its no wonder our nations schools are doing so poor i mean we should just disband the dept of education and go back to home education and get away from this revisionists history enviroentalist brainwashing sex education and evolutionary junk science we dont ned this nonsense
Oh LaShawn!
I can see that some things never change….
We have 6 children. When we only had 3, we started the two oldest in a private Christian School. As each child entered into the school (as I had more…) the cost would go up. But the cost was a gradual thing over time. The kids went to the Christian school until 8th grade. We are fortunate to be in a school system that has only one grade school, one jr. high, and one high school. After 8th grade, the kids go to this public high school….the principle is a Christian, and we are aware of the goings on there as far as health is concerned. You can even opt out of the health class if you want. I now have two graduates of high school, one in high school, and 3 still at the private school. What has the been the cost? It was a sacrificial one…but God provided for us in all those years. We are far from rich. We drive used cars…we rent our home. But we know, that at the right time, we will be able to buy a home. We are patiently waiting for that day. The benefits? My kids have a solid foundation on what is real and what is truth in this world…..they had their moral foundations set. They knew that God was involved in every part of life, not just at church. They are well rounded kids. If someone out there is considering Christian schools, and feel they cant afford it…look at your budget, and see if there are ways you can make it work…and also pray that God will provide. We have been doing this since 1989, and it has been MORE than worth it. Consider the alternative…….
Luckily I live in a school district that does not resort to this kind of thing. Our health & sex education program focuses primarily on abstinance. It could be because we are in a conservative area of Ohio.
Guess what folks? You do have some say in your public school system! After all, it is your tax dollars that are funding the school. Also it is your votes that elect the school board, who have the power to set policies and fire administrators who do not take the community’s concerns into account.
Please do not give up! Many people cannot afford to send their kids to private schools and do not have the resources to home school, especially at the higher grade levels.
Even if you do not have any children in the schools you can take an interest in your school system. Get involved, make a contribution of your time, talent, & treasures, and make a difference. I’ve found that volunteering can build bridges and will give credibility to my voice and opinions. Just showing up at a school board meeting to rant and rave will instantly get you pigeon-holed as a radical right wing fundamentalist. (even if you are speaking the truth)
Honestly I think home schooling or sending your kids to a private school is the easy way out and does nothing to solve the problem. Please do this only as a last resort.
We scraped by for several years to put our children in a parochial grade school, the same one I attended as a child. However, we discovered the education standards mediocre and the children snobbish. We then decided to homeschool. We would have had a very hard time with this option too, if it were not for OHDELA. This is a “long-distance learning charter school” run by David Brennan, who was instrumental in the Cleveland school voucher fight. (We live in a suburb of Cleveland and OHDELA is for Ohio students). Since they are a charter school, they receive the government tax dollars for our children, which they use to buy us homeschooling materials. Many homeschoolers are against this program. From my understanding it is primarily because they want no outside involvement in their child’s education, and OHDELA members must talk to an OHDELA teacher every few weeks and the children must take state proficiency tests. However, it is a perfect option for us where we are. Why not use the tax dollars we pay to support our own children’s education?
I agree, Jim. People have to fight this madness rather than give up!
My son is going to home school his kids for this and other reasons. Much to the consternation of his sister, a high school science teacher and liberal Democrat (arent they all?)
Rod Stanton
Cerritos
La Shawn,
Your comment “Mock God, will you? I wouldn’t do it if I were you” reminded me of verses I read the night before the election.
Isaiah 37:23, 28-29 (NLT) “Whom do you think you have been insulting and ridiculing? Against whom did you raise your voice? At whom did you look in such proud condescension? It was the Holy One of Israel! …. But I know you well — your comings and goings and all you do. I know the way you have raged against me. And because of your arrogance against me, which I have heard for myself, I will put my hook in your nose and my bridle in your mouth. I will make you return by the road on which you came.”
Your post gives one of the many reasons we will be homeschooling when God blesses us with children.
This and the post immediately below are among the most telling reasons why your “values mandate” will evaporate with the Bush victory.
As long as you keep talking about “government controlled” and “state” schools rather than “public” schools you will never succeed in imposing your values anywhere. Rants only go so far.
I’ll just bet that no one who has commented here has ever even considered running for School Board where they live. And I think it unlikely that anyone here has even contributed money to a school board campaign.
Take a tip from an old time Democrat named Tip (Tip O’Neil), “All politics are local.”
You have to believe in goverment to even try to do it well. Since most Conservatives really don’t believe in Government, they do it badly.
There is absolutely nothing that Conservatives will do in the Next Four Years that Conservatives could not have done in the last four years if they really knew how to govern. And, sooner or later, that inability to govern will be your downfall.
You remembered to take your bitter pill this morning, Joseph!
The schools are government-controlled and state-sponsored. Since when is calling a spade “a spade” a bad thing?
Wow.
” Mr. Fishback said Montgomery County “is not a homophobic” community.
“If we don’t [teach this] here because people in another part of the country think differently, then it will always stay bad,” he said. ”
That says it all. Just another attempt at indoctrinating our youth and ultimately our future society into accepting deviant behavior, not just homosexuality but all sexually deviant behavior. Liberals know that it is wrong, unnatural and counterintuitive, yet do not want to give up practicing such lifestyles, so their alternative is to attempt to legitimize it at every opportunity, what better way than the indoctrination of the very future of our nation, the children.
It’s a silly idea.
But something that has bothered me is that Bush has pushed the use of condemns as a means of fighting AIDS in Africa, but conservatives said nothing about it.
Hey, if you can’t translate your “values majority” into political control of local schools which you yourself fund, what was the good of obtaining it?
Do you care for your politics no more than your favorite football team, waving your “we’re #1″ foam hand in the air?
Control of schools is as local as government gets. If the people do not control their own commnunity schools, what do they control, no matter how many votes George W. Bush got?
You say public, we say government controlled.
You say undocumented, we say illegal.
You say Kerry, we say Bush.
You lost, we won!
I want to add to what Jim Stegman said: parents make a difference. I worked on elementary school textbooks, and believe me, the publisher HAD TO conform to the districts’ standards, fueled by the parents.
At one meeting, someone from the publisher lamented the fact that they had to put up with those more conservative areas, because if they didn’t, they wouldn’t be able to sell their textbooks.
Whatever label you give them, you will not get what you want done about them unless you hunker down and do some real work.
It’s your government now. Do you just want to hang it up on your wall?
My daughter goes to a school with classmates who have same sex parents. Should schools ignore the existence of such people in the world? I say no.
We should recognize the world for what it is and educate for the world as it is. The world is round, and our curriculum reflects that. The world is thousands of years old, and our teaching should reflect that.
All education should be supplemented by parents. It is sad but true, that some 10th graders need to know what condoms are and will benefit from knowing. As more gay and lesbian couples have children and raise them, it is appropriate to discuss it as part of a conversation on health, family and community.
Last, I’ve had some good chuckles laughing at comments chock full of spelling errors all the while talking about education. Johnny can’t read, indeed!
Maybe that’s not the best way to go about curving teen pregnancy but something has to be done. I personally have worked in an after school program where there were five young girls pregnant out of 35 total girls. Most of these girls even while pregnant were oblivious to the hindrance they were bringing into their lives. What needs to be done I’m not exactly sure. But I do know that this whole abstinence thing isn’t working for everyone and the home thing isn’t working for a lot of parents. You know what would be cool is if “conservatives and liberals” could come together and create a program that can that cover all bases. That means a program that teaches abstinence as the first line of safety but also shows kids how to protect themselves if something does happen. Maybe also showing kids how to ignore and/or overcome peer pressure because that has to be one of the big reasons so many kids are having sex today.
Rod: Not every teacher is a Democrat. We’ve got several in my Newly Marrieds class who aren’t. Don’t mistake the unions for those who (are forced) to be represented by them.
Jim: I will stay involved in the local schools, sure. But my children will still be homeschooled. I don’t trust the school system out there to do better by my kids than I can do myself. We are long past “last resort” already.
Funny, liberals have no qualms about showing 10th graders how to use condoms, but get hysterical about the word “God” in the Pledge of Allegiance. This is yet another example of the moral depravity of the left.
My daughter is 2 1/2 and we have a boy due 27 Feb. I plan to homeschool for the first few years at least, when they’re too little to be able to witness and understand what is true and what is propaganda. We’ll pray about it each year after that and see where the Lord leads us to put our kids.
My daughter already knows all her letter sounds and names and can spell her name and Mom and Dad. Phonics works! My neighbor who teaches 2nd grade in Alabama says half jokingly that my daughter is doing better than many of her 2nd graders.
We want to make sure our kids have a strong moral and academic foundation before risking the public schools.
Putting condoms on cucumbers?? Sounds to me like they’re trying to prevent the production of more VeggieTales!
*rimshot*
AWG – heh!
Sarah,
I wasn’t trying to say that every teacher is a Democrat. I know that’s not true. What I was trying to say is that the system we have in place now is failing miserably in public schools. A lot of the teenagers today think sex is just a game or something to pass the time. Most kids don’t understand the magnitude of what they are getting themselves into because they have never been taught correctly. A lot of my peer group in high school received a lot of pressure from each other and from the slighty older generation to have sex. The mindset that many of them had was if you were a virgin then you were not as “cool” as people that weren’t.
Not every kid neccessarily needs to know how put a condom on because they are not going to have sex but a lot of them do need to know. Promoting abstinence is not going to stop every teenager from having sex so the only thing we can really do is give them as much information as possible to protect themselves if the need arises.
Teaching children how to avoid STDs and unwanted pregnancies could be a moral issue. We seem to all agree that such teaching should included abstinence; I think we might even agree that abstinence should be given top billing. It should be comprehensive. All education should be.
There is something less than “right” about ignoring the reality: some teenagers are sexually active. For those children, and for those around them. Education could be very powerful. To deny them access to helpful information seems wrong and borderline immoral.
The placement of “under God” in a pledge to our flag is not a moral issue. It is a religious issue.
BTW, I’ve always thought that pledging allegiance to a flag smacked of the kind of golden calf worship that got Moses so riled up, but that’s just me.
This is a perfect example of why we plan to homeschool our children all the way. Thank the Lord we live in a ‘green light’ homeschooling state! In response to Barb M, there are lots of reasons many (but not all, of course) homeschoolers speak out against any use of government funds to support homeschooling of any variety. The biggest is the very legitimate concern that if you take the government’s money, then they’re likely going to want a say in exactly how you educate your children…which then puts ALL homeschoolers at risk, even those who do not take government funding. There are those who would seek to intentionally blur the distinctions between homeschoolers and students being educated through online/distance charter schools for their own profit. If you’re inclined to learn more about this perspective, a great start would be to read current and back issues of Home Education Magazine, with particular focus on Larry and Susan Kaseman. They write a superlative column in every issue about legislative and philosophical issues facing homeschoolers, and their column is thoroughly researched and very inclusive in nature.
Joseph, Joseph….
You said: “I’ll just bet that no one who has commented here has ever even considered running for School Board where they live. And I think it unlikely that anyone here has even contributed money to a school board campaign.”
And yet the very first comment here, posted nearly 4 hours before your ‘wager’ contained the following words: “…it is things like this that make me give serious thought to running for the schoolboard.”
So, will that be cash, credit or paypal? Or would you just prefer a pan-seared dish of… crow?
Darkstar,
Not all conservatives are abstinence advocates (though most I know would advise people to wait until they are old enough to make an informed choice, at the least). Not even all of us Catholic conservatives are complete prudes
Not all conservatives see pre-marital sex as being wrong, either.
Pushing condoms in Africa is a start, but by no means the end. In societies where sex is so freely committed, and used in a economic way by many in the population, condoms are better than nothing.
That being said, American high schools are not in the same place, sexually, as the African nations with the huge aids epidemics.
Wasn’t there a study that recently showed the country with the most progress on aids also had a pretty successful abstinence program?
SCSIwuzzy-
Yes, that nation was Uganda. Their program, nicknamed “ABC,” stresses abstinence, being faithful, and then, if all else fails, condoms. The U.S. AIDs aid to Africa uses the same model. Abstinence first, condoms last.
Here’s one article about this: http://usinfo.state.gov/gi/Archive/2004/Jul/12-199406.html.
There you go, Elizabeth! Saved me from having to go looking for the info.
As with everything else, I blogged about the Uganda abstinence program. Check under Update II for the link.
Thanks for clearing up the point on abstinence, Wuzzy. It’s Christians who see premarital sex as wrong, or who are SUPPOSED to. Not all conservatives are Christians, either. I guess I should be more clear and make distinctions between the two.
Putting my now 16 year old soon in Christian school is the best investment we could ever make. It has been a sacrafice but he is all the better because of it. Not only is the school teaching him about morality and the importance of developing a Christ like character, it is also teaching him to be responsible and equipping him to make choices in life based on biblical prinicipals. You can’t get this from the government regulated public school systems, not even if you serve on the board and are the school board president. For goodness sake, most districts won’t teach Creationism along side Evolution let alone teach abstinence.
Michelle,
Believe it or not, we did do our homework when we decided to go with OHDELA, so I understand that homeschoolers can face difficulties when dealing with the government. However, we have our own perspectives and circumstances which led us to believe that in the end, OHDELA was the right choice for us at this time. When we looked at all of the options, it was public school, a charter school or OHDELA for us. Yes, there are some issues with OHDELA, but the other options have all of them as well. Perhaps there are other families who are in this situation and might be interested in this choice. We’re doing what we can with what we have at this time.
There are so many good suggestions here. We do have to bridge our gaps. We are the parents and grandparents that seem to want exactly the same thing.
I appreciate this post. As you always do LaShawn, you bring important issues to your blog. I enjoy the enviorment here, it is one of hope.
I want to remind commenters who may think I advocate handing over the school system to indecency, I did write this:
“If I couldn’t afford a private school or homeschooling for my as yet unborn children, I’d gather the strength and other Christians to fight this mess until I collapsed from exhaustion.”
Hi, Janelle!
Lashawn I have a question. How much of a role to you think the public schools should play in sex education if any at all?
Ok now, that’s the second trackback from David Limbaugh in as many days. La Shawn, you’re moving on up girl.
That’s the dilemma I’ll have to face next year when my family moves to OKC. For now, at least our public school, though not Christian, does teach religion and creationism along with the rest of the usual coursework for my 2nd grader and kindergartner.
Joe M, you can be sure that my wife and I will be very much involved with the OKC school board and PTA.
Barb,
I wasn’t trying to imply that you or anyone else commenting on the subject hadn’t done their homework! Quite the contrary – I find that most people who have struggled with the decision on where and how to educate their child are to be commended for the effort they put into investigating the options, no matter what path they ultimately choose. I was just adding my 2 cents that were sparked by your question “Why not use the tax dollars we pay to support our own children’s education?” I hope I did not offend.
Christian conservatives shouldnt expect American public schools to provide a ‘Christian’ education. Im not saying its wrong, im saying its wrong to have a Christian education as the free schooling norm. Morality does not all come from Christian teachings. p.s, I dont think there is any need not to show this comment.
That’s definitely an improvement over the other comment, Mariachi. This is a Christian blog and your rants against the faith will not be posted.
The moral law comes from the Bible. That is what we believe. Secularists understand that Christians have values but fail to understand they have “values” of their own. Their worldview, code of ethics or whatever they call it, tells them it’s OK to show kids videos of condoms and cucumber/dildos. THAT IS A VALUE JUDGMENT. My value system tells me homosexuality is wrong. Secularists and liberals think it’s OK. THAT IS A VALUE JUDGMENT.
I say keep sex ed out of the schools and in the home and church where it belongs. If the parents don’t give a darn, sponsor some after-school off-site program for the kids (preferably funded by the private sector), with abstinence until marriage or at least adulthood stressed. But not on school time! And allow religious types in there, too.
Andy – I didn’t know your kids were so young. For some reason I assumed they were teens.
Nope, they’re luvable liddle wugwats, or to use my term of endearment, “Nu-Nu(s)”
Whether you homeschool, public school, or private school, make sure your kids can read!
You can take a free reading grade level test at http://www.nrrf.org. For kids 2 years old to 2nd grade, you can learn phonics for free online at http://www.starfall.com. Plus, it’s a lot of fun. My 2 1/2 year old loves it. For kids in the 2nd grade and older and adults, I have free online phonics lessons and spelling hints at http://www.thephonicspage.org. My lessons use the book of Romans to teach reading with phonics. They aren’t as much fun as the lessons at Starfall, but they work.
I ‘ranted’ against no religion. If im guilty of ranting, then maybe its against indoctrinating kids into a certain religion via the federal education system.
La Shawn, im sure a lot of parents want their kids to know the facts of life. Denying it because of religious views is your choice to make. Anyone can pull their child out of this particular education system.
Well, it was a rant to me, and since it’s my blog and the only free speech protections on it belong to me, I chose not to post it.
I’m sure many more parents DON’T want their kids taught the “facts of life” by liberal teachers pushing an agenda. Inherent in your comments on this blog is that Christians are somehow pushing their values because they don’t want their kids “taught” about homosexuality or sex “education.” I say we remove all “sex ed” from public schools. You have it backwards. Such things can be taught in private or Christian schools – whatever values they want to convey – but public schools may not do it.
Lashawn wouldn’t the after school program be pretty hard to implement. Do you think teens that really need a sex education program would take the initiative to get in the program? It seems like teens would need some guidance to get in the program which would most likely have to come from their parents. And for the parents who don’t give a darn their kids would be in the same situation they’re currently in.
There are no easy answers, Rod, but the government should not be teaching kids their view of sex. If it’s a health class teaching about the reproductive system, that’s one thing. But teaching that two men living together with a kid is just another family? Montgomery County is doing all this in 10th grade, but I know they’re doing this in some middle schools. It is a value judgment to presume to “teach” kids how to have “safe sex.” That is not their job, slack parents notwithstanding.
Let’s educate the slack PARENTS. There’s an idea.
And they don’t want the Christian worldview taught at all! Scoundrels. They might be fooling everyone else, but they’re not fooling me.
Mariachi, it was the US that practically founded the concept of “public schooling” for all. Oftentime, the only textbook was the Bible which took care of 2 of the 3 Rs. This was generally so thruout the early history of US civilization, even longer in places where funds for textbooks were tight.
Overall, the Bible was the first textbook since the first settlers set foot on these shores and to this date, in some circles, it remains the everlasting foundation for education. Like it or not, that’s one textbook that keeps on teachin’ & teachin’ long after others have come and gone.
Here’s two quotes for you. One on the Bible as the foundation for education, and another on the hi-faluting modern sciences.
William Holmes McGuffey, author of the McGuffey Reader, which was used for over 100 years in our public schools, with over 125 million copies sold, until it was stopped in 1963. President Lincoln called him the “Schoolmaster of the Nation.
“The Christian religion is the religion of our country. From it are derived our nation, on the character of God, on the great moral Governor of the universe. On its doctrines are founded the peculiarities of our free Institutions. From no source has the author drawn more conspicuously than from the sacred Scriptures. For all these extracts from the Bible, I make no apology.”
—————————–
Thomas A. Edison is no mean scientist, and this is what he says on the subject in Suggestive Therapeutics:
“There are more frauds in modern science than anywhere else. Take a whole pile of them that I can name, and you will find uncertainty, if not imposition, on half of what they state as scientific truth. They have time and again set down experiments as done by them, curious, out-of-the-way experiments that they never did, and upon which they have founded so-called scientific truths. I have been thrown off my track often by them, and for months at a time. Try the experiments yourself, and you will find the result altogether different. I tell you I’d rather know nothing about a thing in science, nine times out of ten, than what the books would tell me; for practical purposes, for applied science, the best science, the only science, I’d rather take the thing up and go through with it myself, I’d find out more about it than anyone could tell me, and I’d be sure of what I know. That’s the thing. Professor this or that will controvert you out of the books that it can’t be so, though you have it right in the hollow of your hand all the time, and could break his spectacles with it!”
What will the scientists say to this testimony from such an expert? And what will the many who have been accustomed to put so much faith in science say?“
That’s a good point that the government shouldn’t be teaching children their view of sex. But there has to be some middle ground to teaching sex education. Like I said earlier we need both sides to just come together and create a program that teaches abstinence as the first line of defense but also shows kids how to protect themselves if the need arises. Even the most devout Christians have times of weakness and may give into temptation, but with the right knowledge it doesn’t have to be a life altering mistake.
I do agree that Montgomery County’s program has crossed the line. Trying to teach kids that homosexual couples are the newest American family has no place in sex education or K-12 schools for that matter. Also talking about flavored condoms is defeating the purpose if you ask me because that seemingly makes sex more enjoyable. In there case they definitely need to rethink what their doing.
Sex education is a crucial part of growing up. Ignorance on the matter is simply wrong, in my opinion.
Come now, theres no need to resort to the old ‘Liberal teachers’ thing. These people have a job to do. They dont MAKE the curiculem. This is what they are TOLD to teach.
Well, i think i have it right. Teaching kids about sex is neccesary. You cant just ignore it and hope it will go away. Better to know what they are doing when they are teenagers, than to have no clue whatsoever.
Andy, the Bible was laid seperate from the Constitution from its very creation. In the religious 19th century, the whole ‘Christian’ world followed similiar standards. Even so called secular nations. Things have changed.
I guess I’m not making myself clear. A government school does not have a mandate to teach about how to have “safe sex.” Back when I was in school we had health education classes that taught a number of things, including how the reproductive system works. That is completely different than showing kids how to put on a condom and giving them a choice of flavors, for crying out loud!
THAT is NOT what they’re supposed to be doing. Whether kids learn about sex from a bathroom wall or from their parents, it isn’t up to government schools. And if schools refrained from teaching “safe sex” and concentrated on teaching kids how to read and just plain think, maybe they’d be a whole lot better off. It doesn’t necessarily mean kids will be ignorant about sex. That’s what parents are for. This is why no child of mine will ever attend government schools.
And I will continue to resort to the old “liberal teachers” thing because it is true. Many are also socialists. Underqualified, bureaucratic, secular socialists teaching my kid about sex? Please.
One more thing. The bureaucrats who set the curriculum are included in my remarks, so don’t parse terms and waste time discussing how teachers “do what they’re told.”
LaShawn,
I know many here have been discussing homeschooling. My younger brother(he’s a public school admin.) and his wife homeschool. They definitely DO NOT have money, however, my sister-in-law has done a lot of research in this area, and has found a fairly inexpensive homeschool curriculum. She also has a website where she links to a lot of these sites. I was thinking that it might be a good resource for those on your site who are seeking to homeschool. If you would like, you can post her website addy. It is the following:
anneshomeyplace.com
Both Kraig and Anne are solid Christians, and they are raising their children(just had #5 today) to be Godly, Christian children and adults. She also has many other resources on her site that deal with running a Christian household.
P.S. Sorry for writing this in the open forum, but when I click on your “contact” link, for some reason it’s not opening my email program to email you.
Even if we take sex education out of schools it isn’t gonna make parents who don’t care now magically start caring. We would basically be giving up on a lot of youth who do have to learn sex education from a bathroom wall and from the guy down the street who doesn’t do anything but make babies. Like you said the kids these days aren’t ignorant. They know what sex is and how to do it, but what they don’t know is why it’s in their best interest to abstain.
Rod, I’m not contending that parents will automatically care about the children they produced. Shameful that they don’t, I know. But when/how did government because the purveyors of values pertaining to sex? The very idea is ridiculous.
You see, the problems stem from the breakdown of the culture, including the family. The 60s permissiveness wreaked havoc in the black community, in my opinion.
As one of the few Republicans living in MoCo (much less TP), I can only shake my head in disgust.
Then again, my precinct had, on Election Day, inside the precinct itself, a Democratic Party official organizing volunteers – he was walking around the voter check-in, the voting booths, socializing with poll workers – so WHY am I surprised by anything that happens here?
Regards,
Takoma Park Voter “R-1″
A Republican in Takoma Park??? Welcome to the blog!
We are here – perhaps in small numbers (probably why I was voter “R-1″ on Election Day LOL. I am yet amazed no one tossed a brick through my window when I hung “Bush/Cheney” signage in it! Thanks for having me – it’s a safe harbor
The government may have had pressure from outside sources to do something about it. And you got to figure from a reach standpoint what better way to teach kids about sex ed than in the public schools. Was it right? Maybe/maybe not but the government stepped up to the plate for some reason or another.
Also I found a good article pertaining to sex education and the schools in Seattle. I’m putting a small excerpt and the url below.
“These students talk casually about weekend sexual encounters with a boyfriend or girlfriend. They believe oral sex isn’t really sex. Girls, especially, are surprised to learn they can contract diseases such as chlamydia or gonorrhea from the practice.”
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/snohomishcountynews/2002085804_sexeducation09m.html
I can tell with certainty two things. I never heard of La Shawn before; the second just as important thing is that she has got things pretty well figured out. I can’t see a thing wrong with her sense. I wish more people would listen to her. So, when I “say it”, I’m saying “well done” and I hope she keeps it up.
This year, for my own children stuck in the gov’t controlled public schools system, I signed and sent in paperwork spelling out EXACTLY what they may not teach my children regarding sex, sexuality and human relationships. Not that my geographical area is overly liberal when it comes to these subjects, just that educators ARE educators.
I would not be opposed to them teaching about condom usage IF they paired it up with the REAL data of condom failure. Yes, failure EVEN WHEN USED PROPERLY. Industry standards allow for approx. 6 defective condoms per 1000. Russian roulette, anyone? It is not a reliable means of preventing pregnancy NOR AIDS. Teaching the children that condoms will protect them is horribly negligent.
I can’t speak for anyone else here. I want my children to live long, healthy lives to the best of their ability. I teach abstinance. I also teach them that the typical gap in a perfectly normal latex condom is 5 microns. The HIV virus is 0.1 micron. You do the math.
Condoms can and do lower the risk of infection. That does not make them “safe” nor a “prevention”, by any stretch of the imagination. Being one of ONLY 15% to contract HIV from proper condom usage would not ease my mind. Would it ease yours?
Teach the children they are better than rutting pigs. Self-control is the only REAL solution.
Kiki, actually I’m glad you posted as I’m collecting homeschooling links and ideas. Thanks.
…secularists are under the mistaken impression that their indecent dogma is value-neutral and rational while ours (Christians) is theocratic Dark Ages hogwash….
LaShawn, I caution you to not brand all that do not believe
as you as ‘indecent’. I am an atheist. You know thatalready
My thoughts (dogma?) are NOT value-neutral. Nor or are my
thoughts irrational vis a vis re theology.
I truly beleive all children should have all the exposure
they can absorb to ALL forms of faith.
I cannot condone an emphasis on one or the other. I am
an American and KNOW that this country is founded on the
teachings of Christ. That said.
I won’t allow those teachings, nor any other teachings,
to be more ‘recognized’ than any other.
EXCEPT for this.
This land was founded by men of good faith. Faith in their
God. As such, it has served us well and I will fight to the
death any who would argue other.
This’ll sound funny coming from me … but … this is a
country founded on the precepts of Christianity. I have
no problem with that.
I have a serious problem with those that would take that
away from me or any other American.
Live and let live is what this place is all about.
There will be some who take that to an extreme beyond
reason. To hell with them. (sorry)
It is the mix of us that makes the best of us.
And there is NO room for those beyond the Judeo-Christian
to try an instill their beliefs upon on us or our kids.
There IS A LINE to be drawn. My own personal line is drawn
between us, as a people, holding some things true, and
them that don’t and have another concept of reality in
mind.
But please, LaShawn, don’t be so hasty as to brand me or
others like me, as ‘the unbelievers’. We know. And we are
on your side. Hard as that might be to believe.
I do not have to know your God to know the he is the god
of this land … and I kinda like it that way. Seems to
have worked pretty damned good so far.
So, even though I might be of a small demographic, have
some consideration for me.
I’m on your side, despite my atheism.
Steel
As i said La Shawn, these supposedly ‘Socialist’ teachers follow a government curiculem. They dont just teach whatever they want.
Once again, I never claimed teachers taught “whatever they want.” Why are we discussing minutiae? If you insist on parsing each comment I make, we’re going in circles – nowhere. I’m getting off the ride.
Steel – The indecency I’m referring to is the so-called sex “education” going on in government schools. I’m not impugning (or didn’t mean to) all unbelievers, OK?
And I say again! Good Riddance!
http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=235904&page=1
Any suggestions for a follow-up title to Robert Bork’s 1996 book Slouching Towards Gomorrah? How about – Now That We’ve Arrived…
Just a random thought.
La Shawn – what you DID claim were these supposedly liberal/socialist teachers were pushing their own agenda, or whatever. I said this was false, for reasons stated.
The so called ‘Bureaucrats’ that set the curiculem arnt a bunch of Liberals, as you suggest. Popular to contrary belief, the ‘Liberals’ dont ‘control’ anything. Just like the Commies didnt control anything during the McCarthy scare campaign days.
“These students talk casually about weekend sexual encounters with a boyfriend or girlfriend. They believe oral sex isn’t really sex. Girls, especially, are surprised to learn they can contract diseases such as chlamydia or gonorrhea from the practice.”
I see this rationale for sex ed. often. But since sex ed. in public schools has been around for several decades now, how is it that these kids aren’t ‘educated’ about sex? The explaination is always that ‘we’ (the education system) aren’t teaching the kids enough about it. ‘We’ need to make it ‘fun’. Let’s have the kids put condoms on bananas. Let’s have them watch movies of kids putting condoms on cucumbers. Does the problem of teenage pregnancy and skyrocketing teen STD’s boil down to the fact that kids don’t use condoms because they don’t know how to put them on? These people don’t get it. Does encouraging homosexual behavior and oral sex help prevent STD’s? No, quite the opposite. The people who create these curricula for the schools are trying to sexualize kids.
My husband and I have 9 kids. We send the younger ones to private school, and homeschool the highschoolers. My advise would be that if you’re of the ’stay and fight it out’ frame of mind…start BEFORE your kids are old enough to start school.
NINE kids???????? WOW! I guess I’ll never complain about having 3 again!!!!
[exhausted just thinking about 6 more youngins]
Chillin
Mariachi, If you don’t believe that liberals control the schools, think again. My husband is a school teacher and the principals and administration are liberals. They bring in liberal speakers for teacher inservices. Sometimes, to be a Bush supporter is to be the pariah of the school. You can thank NEA and other teacher’s unions for all of that.
And if you think for one moment the teachers do not interject their ideals onto the students, think again. The good news is that the wily students are smart enough to argue. I once had a high school English teacher try to tell me the Bible doesn’t say being gay is wrong. Was that on the curriculum? It happens all the time.
Mariachi – it might hurt your sensibilities, but you really should read Treason by Ann Coulter for a more historically accurate view of Joseph McCarthy. *shakes head*
Julie – congrats on your nine kids! What’s the age range?
I ‘ranted’ against no religion. If im guilty of ranting, then maybe its against indoctrinating kids into a certain religion via the federal education system.
Posted by Mariachi at 7:31 on 10 Nov.
Maybe you were not aware that every day, in every way, right now in the public schools, religion is being indoctrinated. The religion is called secular humanism, which basically affirms that Man created God in his own image. That God is no longer a useful concept because there is no absolute truth. (The only exception being that the absolute truth is that there is no real God.)
Most public schools are, if not rabidly, at least generally anti-Christian, thanks to the left and the decade of decadence led by William Jefferson Clinton, who was not even sure of the meaning of “is”.
Also, let’s be clear that the 10 commandments are not the expression of Christianity. They were given to a Jew named Moses directly by God. They represent God’s view of morality. Now, since Christians worship that same God, the also espouse the 10 Commandments. You might be interested in knowing that the founding father’s thought these were important principles.
The so-called “tolerant” left is tolerant of almost anything except Biblical morality. Child pornography? no problem. How about the North American Man Boy Love Association (NAMBLA)? Great bunch of guys. How about Howard Stern. Courageous man. How about John Ashcroft? You mean that Bible-waving, hymn singing, right wing nut?
How about accepting that homosexuality is a choice and not genetic? How dare you use such hate speech!!! BTW check II Cor 6. Note “such WERE some of you” (emphasis added).
I have to agree with Joseph that we must involve ourselves in the community and local politics is the Bush victory is not to evaporate. I will be doing my part.
Mariachi is just spinning for the LLL. It doesn’t matter if he repeats a million times the lie that we are founded as a secular nation, it won’t make it the truth. Nor will it take away what practically each and every one of the founders had to say about God, Christianity (good) and state sponsored religious dogma (bad) and freewill to choose what to believe (good).
What the LLL won’t admit to is that ALL beiefs systems are a form of religion, believing in nothing (illogical as that is) is still a form of religion. Therefore, teaching/imposing values-neutral is still a breach of the separation of church & state. A state sponsored religion of moral relativity.
The best way to nip all this in the bud is to stick to the 3-Rs and forget about sex ed, etc. Just the facts Ma’am. If it’s a theory, then all theories need equal time.
And while we’re at it, bring back the dead white men front & center — they shaped this country, therefore teach the good they did, w/o ignoring the bad and ugly and let the kids come to their own conclusion thru a fair discussion of the merits thereof.
Rick, that’s exactly the point I’ve been trying to make. Secular Humanism is a religion! Public schools are teaching its values (homosexuality is OK, kids should be taught how to fornicate “safely”) but will NOT allow Christian values.
Just like the Commies didnt control anything during the McCarthy scare campaign days.
Comment by Mariachi — 11.11.04 @ 10:33 am
As it turns out, Mariachi, the communists were very highly placed in the government. The Venona project revealed that Soviet spies were throughout the Truman administration. Alger Hiss was never convicted of spying, but he WAS convicted of perjury because he said he was not a spy (statute of limitations on spying had expired by the time he actually went to trial).
Steel-
I salute your honesty and integrity.
Andy-
I think the problem with the current sex education and movie sex is that there is no mention of the effects of STD. My son works in a hospital ER and they “double-glove” because there might be a problem with a single glove. The fact is that intercourse or even oral sex with an infected person might in turn infect you. That is why abstinence is the only “safe sex”. Condoms provide some measure of safety, but deep throat kissing eliminates that protection just as effectively as a leaking condom.
The facts of life are that sex is risky (with or without condoms) unless you know your partner is healthy. Sex can produce a baby (not an “unwanted pregnancy”) and you should be prepared for that consequence.
I have no problem with a clinical discussion of the “facts of life” – I just don’t want immorality added in. I especially don’t want deviant (”alternative”) life styles lauded as “normal.”
Rick I absolutely agree.
You cant read the bible to kids in school but you can read DADDYS ROOMATE and HEATHER HAS TWO MOMMIES and if you showed VEGGIE TALES or BIBLEMAN you would get fired but i,ll bet they will have prenty of this harry potter stuff in schools or even books on black magic what wrong with our schools is too much goverment
‘Border-line kiddie porn is here to stay.’
Cucumbers aren’t porn.
You’re welcome, Andy. I hope her website helps you. If you have any further question, she has a link to where you can contact her from her website. Don’t hesitate to do so, either. Kraig and Anne are passionate about homeschooling, and they enjoy talking about such things, and helping to direct people who want to homeschool.
If you do contact her in the next couple days, please give her a bit to answer you. She just had a baby yesterday, so she may not be on the internet for awhile.
Andy – I had to take a second look @ your comments b/c “LLL” in my world is the La Leche League.
Good comments, everyone.
actus – seriously, I wonder about your ability to make connections. The lowly cucumber is replacing a male sexual organ (I think the other word may get caught in the filter). Sexuality misused for entertainment or titillation is porn, as far as I’m concerned. This is titillating rather than educating.
‘actus – seriously, I wonder about your ability to make connections. The lowly cucumber is replacing a male sexual organ (I think the other word may get caught in the filter) Sexuality misused for entertainment or titillation is porn, as far as I’m concerned. This is titillating rather than educating.’
I know exactly the role it is playing. Its a model necessary for education.
If porn was meant, perhaps they would have used something that wasn’t so.. . vegetable.
Right on LawWife
LawWife-
The age range of my kids is 16 yrs. to 16 months.
The public school systems have no problem with teaching religion. They have a problem with mentioning Chritianity. The public schools in our area teach about Jewish holidays, teach about Islam, teach secular humanism. I’ve heard of schools teaching Wiccan rituals to ‘help the children deal with stress.’ They teach the religion of environmentalism…not teaching the children to be good stewards of the Earth, but they practically worship the Earth. The problem is that they are willing to teach EVERYTHING except Christianity.
Rick – the paranoia you are still insisting on is unfounded. Several spies were indeed found out during the 1950’s, as were American spies in the USSR. So what? Spies have been found continually throughout our history. Even, shock horror, Israeli ones. The McCarthy era was nothing short of a witch hunt, with innocent men having their lives ruined, and anyone even remotely to the left being accused of this so called crime. Its important to note being a Commie isnt a crime at all, despite what the FBI thought. They illegally spied on and locked up many members of the legitimate Communist party.
Teaching the basics of human reproduction, the biology and physiology of it is fine by me once kids reach puberty and as long as it is done gender-segregated classes (for the comfort of the students AND teachers). However, Teaching kids how to have “safe” sex and moving beyond biology to morality and laying down the liberal mantra of alternative lifestyles is teaching secular humanism, which is a religion. It should not be tolerated in the schools.
Plain and simple: I’ll teach my 3 kids the morality of sex and relationships, the schools can teach science & biology. No cucumbers, no moralizing about lifestyles, no two-mommy/two daddy stuff. I don’t want someone else’s values taught to my kids using my tax dollars, and I would suspect liberals & homosexuals would feel the same way if their children were being taught my conservative, Christian values.
Parents teach morals & values; schools teach the 3 R’s and science. Period. For those whose parents don’t do the job, how is that any different from the scads of things so many fail at today? Is the school to address them all? How would there be enough time? There is no correction for bad parenting.
While teaching abstinence is certainly the best thing, I find it to be highly impractical in this day and age. Let’s face it: kids want to have sex and they will. Doesn’t make it right or “morally” acceptable (you conservatives crack me up with the way you throw around the word), but I feel in-depth discussions and sex education can indeed make a difference. A report came out several days later that said teenage pregnancies are now down dramatically for the first time in, like, 60 years I believe the article stated.
I think this is a clear indication that open sex-ed programs can reduce the amount of sex with teenagers. It’s certainly more practical than teaching abstinence, which is basically nothing more than a teacher waving a magic wand in the hopes that the students will follow the lesson.
I agree with the cucumber/condom thing. This is just silly. As for promoting homosexual marriage, perhaps schools should leave the whole relationship discussion out of the curriculum. I was raised–proudly–by two liberals who taught me to respect ALL relationships regardless of sexual preference. I don’t think marriage needs to be taught in public schools no matter the sexual ideology.
What should be taught in school is respect. Respect for differing opinions and sexual preferences. You don’t have to like anything, but respect shows us all that human beings deserve more than being called a “f*g” or a “ni***r” simply because one’s religious “superiority” has dictated such.
Julie, I agree with your comment re: teaching religion in public school.
I believe in God, but I refuse to adhere to ANY religion. I think religion is a crutch for the weakness of man. That’s just my opinion.
However, I think RELIGION as a course of study is simply fascinating. I eat it up. I am totally fine with public schools teaching religion. As long as it covers ALL ideas and viewpoints. So, that means Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Atheism, Paganism….EVERYTHING. Even those against atheists and pagans often find something interesting to learn by taking such general “survey” courses. I took two or three religion courses in college and I loved them. Even though I don’t currently–nor will I ever, I think–subscribe to any one religion, I do believe it’s an awfully interesting course of study and I highly recommend it for everyone.
I come from the train of thought that says we as humans should learn as much as we can about our fellow humans. Learn about their religion, learn about their culture. And, yes, though we may disagree, learn about their opposing lifestyles. I think it only makes us better and stronger in the end.
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