GWBush’s administration has had ample time to say, “Oops, we goofed”. They haven’t. When you PERSIST in deception in the face of facts to the contrary, that is lying.

Thread drift or Six Degrees of Seperation?

The whole world didn’t think Saddam had WMD. I was reasonably sure they didn’t. I didn’t KNOW, but I was reasonably sure. So, since I didn’t think so, your statement dies a cruel death. Ha!

BTW, all the comments you cited were speculative, No one stated a FACT. Kennedy says ‘pursuit’. Kerry left himself an out. Frenchie (Chirac) said “MAY lead (one) to think”. Bill Cohen, who made the strongest statement, STILL offered an opinion.

But, I am done with this. You guys are going to get me in hot water with the Queen. I don’t need that kind of trouble. God bless and keep you both. Peace.

I mention Kerry, because that was our only alternative to GWB’s strategy. I have no doubt that he would cut and run and we’d be in a bigger mess, not to mention AQ emboldened by their “Tet” victory.

There’s nothing wrong with disagreement, even within party politics. Scowcroft and others would rather maintain security by containment. That’s certainly a reasoned position. But in my mind, does nothing to proactively counter evil.

Again, the whole thurst of my comment was to take issue with your statement that the ideology behind war launching is irrelevant and based on lies. I say that the ideology behind not dealing with Iraq IAW UN resolutions was based on lies and greed and the truth in that is borne out by Oil for Food.

I almost hate to get into this, because there is never an end to it, but here we go. The accusation that Bush lied about WMD is not supportable by facts. A lie must be a deliberate act to deceive, and nothing indicates that this was the case. The whole world thought Saddam had WMD.

“There is no doubt that Saddam Hussein’s regime is a serious danger, that he is a tyrant, and that his pursuit of lethal weapons of mass destruction cannot be tolerated. He must be disarmed.” — Teddy Kennedy, 2002

“I will be voting to give the president of the United States the authority to use force – if necessary – to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security.” — John Kerry, 2002

“What is at stake is how to answer the potential threat Iraq represents with the risk of proliferation of WMD. Baghdad’s regime did use such weapons in the past. Today, a number of evidences may lead to think that, over the past four years, in the absence of international inspectors, this country has continued armament programs.” — Jacques Chirac, 2002

“I am absolutely convinced that there are weapons…I saw evidence back in 1998 when we would see the inspectors being barred from gaining entry into a warehouse for three hours with trucks rolling up and then moving those trucks out.” — William Cohen, 2003

Liars, all?

I have no issue with DEFENDING democracy. Haiti would be an EXCELLENT place to start, seeing as it is in our own back yard. What? I see. It isn’t important enough, even though it has a democratic form of government. Dang them for having no oil!

Defending democracy is cool. Forcing it upon folks who may not want it is not. Time will tell if it will bear good fruit.

My point Andy was that bad manners exist everywhere you look on the political dial. Those pies throwers were obviously liberal. The guys and dolls that would douse an expensive fur with red paint are even further to the left. The pre-emptive war launcher is from the right of the dial. If someone is wrong, what difference does the ideology make? They are wrong. They are gulity of bad manners. All of that is pretty simple.

When the first Gulf War was fought, I was still in Marine Corps green. I was in COMPLETE support of it. Why? Because Iraq had illegally invaded a sovereign nation, Kuwait. The oil (heh, heh, heh) was secondary. (I didn’t know I would be driving a Yukon Denali now. Shoot, they didn’t even exist!) I even agree with you that Saudi Arabia, that cradle of terrorists, was next on Saddam’s agenda. He had to be stopped. And believe me, I was quite puzzled when GHWBush stopped the ground war so soon. So no, I haven’t forgotten that Saddam’s bad manners preceded those of GWBush.

Where are the WMD? Where is the link–ideological, financial, material/materiel or otherwise–between Saddam and Osama? If you can show me where, I will retract my statement that the Bush administration lied about Iraq. I mean, wasn’t David Kay’s report supposed to show them? Ask Mr. Kay about that now, if you will.

I’ll say this: had the weapons inspectors been allowed to do their jobs, THEN war was launched, you’d have heard nary a peep from me, assuming they found WMD.

Congressperson? Mrs. Norton doesn’t have a vote. I live in Washington, DC, where I PROUDLY display my “Taxation Without Representation” license plates.

I do think it is humorous that you find a need to kick John Kerry when I never even mentioned the poor soul.

And Andy, if this country isn’t violent, what is it? Human nature can be violent, yes. However, WHAT MAKES UP A NATION? Humans, maybe? And please understand that all violence isn’t bad, if you will. Some violence is ABSOLUTELY necessary. Armageddon surely won’t be a walk in the park. You could make a case that God is the most violent personality in the universe, if you understand that eternal justice/judgment and violence will go hand in hand. Hell is a violent place.

I dig the word pusillanimous. Reminds me of Dr. Smith on ‘Lost In Space’.

I will admit even my violent tendencies. I intend to become even more violent in the days to come. Confused? Open your bible to Matthew 11:12. If that is too radical for you, see Luke 16:16. Same statement, just toned down slightly for the squeamish.

Maybe using the phrase ‘bad manners’ was a bit too cheeky for you. If so, I can’t apologize. I can be a cheeky/sarcastic kind of guy. I just don’t take myself too seriously, because none of this is about me and what I may think at any given moment. I just hope we can continue to be civil, no matter our ideological differences. In other words, I PROMISE not to throw food on you or at you. Deal?

Semper Fi!

P.S. Don’t assume that everyone that doesn’t march in lockstep with your views is a liberal. Peace.

Sorry I missed your response to my comment until now. I didn’t have too much problem with your comment (#29) or that you might mention Iraq. The only problem I had was “The ideology of the pie thrower/paint splasher/war launcher is irrelevant.”

My point is war launcher? Who? Irrelevant ideology? How? Why?

Have you forgotten that Saddam was the original war launcher, first by coup and the subsequent and ever on-going purges, eventually leading to attacking neighbors? If we didn’t stop him in ‘91, Saudi was next in line and eventully the world. Yes, Saddamn had visions of a 1,000 year claiphate and set about building monuments to his greatness to prove it.

Sound like anyone we know from history? Come to think of it, we were weren’t even attacked by that dude before FDR started plan to “launch” a war on him by attacking Africa first. Hmm, I wonder why?

Since you were former military, I’ll spare you the history lesson. Except to say you seem to have a problem with JFK’s promise to defend democracy whereever & whenever necessary.

Imagine that! GWB, RWR & JFK sharing the same ideology why sKerry flip-flops around for the right ideology that’ll move him into the world’s #1 address, regardless of personal conviction. How’s that for relativist ideology!

As for your accusations of “all lies”. That has been examined ad nauseum and found wanting not only in other postings on this blog. I dare say your congressman even discounts your accusations as well as your former chain of command to boot. Someone’s been drinking Kool-aid, question is who?

In conclusion, I want to correct the fatal flaw in your stated ideology. This country is NOT violent! HUMAN NATURE is violent, regardless of ideology, race or creed. Who was it that more or less said “it takes a violent man to stand up to evil while the pusilanimous run and hide”?

Semper Fi!

Too late to worry about Manifest Destiny. I raised it only to butress a simple point: America is VIOLENT and sometime unjustly so. There are territorial principalities (mayhaps this is too deep for you) that are charged with making sure it stays that way.

You make foolish assumptions. I am NOT a Peacenik. I spent most of my adult life in the United States Marine Corps–certainly not a Peacenik outfit. But you are good at name-calling, as your post indicates.

The Bush administration has lied about the reasons for invading Iraq. It seemed for a while they were even coming up with a new reason weekly. The fact is, Iraq had no WMD. They said Saddam and Osama were allied–they weren’t/aren’t. Since these things weren’t true, that makes their statements a LIE. An untrue statement is a lie. Had they said, “We made a mistake”, they would be forgiven. But since they say they have no sin, it is ever before them. (Forgive the obscure scriptural reference.)

Appeasing thirld world despots? You show your ugly prejudice by even daring to call the people of the cradle of civilization third world. First, second, third. I won’t even comment any further on that.

Know your history (or at least your politics). China has had the capability to launch nukes for a while, before Bill Clinton. As for North Korea (I served in Korea for a while), that is still an open book. Hopefully the Bush administration will do better.

It isn’t this country’s job to install democracy around the world. If you find that charge in the Constitution, I suppose I’d have to eat a copy of it.

I’d accuse you of disjointed thinking but why should I pile on? I said the country is violent. It is. I wish it wasn’t, but that won’t make it any safer. You ABUSE the notion of free speech by shooting off like a loose cannon. Read what is said. Digest it. THEN comment. I pray you develop some Critical Thinking Skills. Failing that, at least grow up. Maturity trumps immaturity in the grand scheme of things. Peace.

Does anybody else remember this and remember who was throwing the pies and who was eating them?

All lefties are pie throwers – FALSE
All pie throwers are lefties – TRUE

Same deal as:

All drunks are guilty of DWI – FALSE
All those convicted of DWI are drunks – TRUE

Still doesn’t look very good for the reputation of drunks, even if most don’t drive while schwacked.

I didn’t see your response to my comment before now.

I do follow the news, but more importantly, I follow real life. I don’t see my liberal friends out throwing pies. I don’t hear my liberal friends condoning pie-throwing. I agree that Ms. Coulter and Mr. Horowitz and Mr. Buchanon had every right to press charges and should have done so.

But there is simple math that you’re forgetting in your stereotype. How is it that in roughly a half-dozen pie-throwing incidents, the character of every single liberal is marred? Are there a half-dozen conservatives committing adultery today? I’d venture to guess the answer is yes. Are there a half-dozen liberals driving drunk today? I’d venture to guess the answer is yes. So what we can seemingly deduce from that is that all conservatives are adulterers and all liberals are drunk drivers. That seems reasonable to me, since stereotypes are acceptable.

As for the America-hating liberal website, I really haven’t a clue which that might be. If someone is making threats against the President, that’s a serious matter that should be dealt with. I’m probably just nuts, though, for not immediately disavowing my beliefs, which I’ve built through education and experience, when a few liberals do something stupid.

Now here’s an interesting little story. I went to the Nationals game last night, and President Bush threw the first pitch. Guess how long I booed him? Want to make an assumption, knowing that I’m a liberal “whiney-punk-***-coward”? If you guessed anything other than 0 seconds, you’re wrong. Do you know why I didn’t boo President Bush? Because I don’t hate America. I don’t hate President Bush. I respect the office. It’s important. I disagree with him on certain fundamental issues, but he’s still the President and that commands respect. My only contention is that I’m not going to sit idly by and accept things I disagree with. I’m going to voice my opinion and work to improve this country.

Liberal equals pie-thrower as much as conservative equals Timothy McVeigh. Not at all. But really, believe whatever you want. Just don’t delude yourself into thinking that the world is so simple as to conform to your stereotype.