Monday, April 24: Comments closed on this post. A defense lawyer wants to see the evidence. Read and discuss the latest news.
Friday, April 21: Comments closed. Read and discuss the latest news on the case.
Thursday, April 20: Looking for pictures of duke stripper?
Tuesday, April 18: This post is closed to comments. Read the latest news about the arrest of two lacrosse players.
Monday, April 17: Gregory Kane:
[B]efore black folks start talking about how, at the very least, Duke lacrosse players obviously don’t hold black women in very high esteem, we’d better ask ourselves where they got that notion. Could it have been from those black rap artists who feature black “exotic dancers” in their videos doing the same thing those two black women in Durham were probably doing at the lacrosse team’s party?
Respect for black women should start at home. Before we get angry at Duke lacrosse players who may only be guilty of excessive boozing and ogling, we should call into account Jay-Z and Ludacris and 50 Cent and fill-in-name-of-black-male-rapper-here for how black women are portrayed in their videos.
Saturday, April 15: I said I’d try to stay away for three days, but what do I know? I wanted to point you to this must-read commentary: The Rape That Never Was: Why, In Light Of The Lack Of DNA Evidence, The Case Against Duke’s Lacrosse Team Should Be Dropped.
In other news…remember Alicia Hardin? Her fake-hating led to a felony conviction.
***Scroll Down for Updates***
She’s not Greek. Her face didn’t launch 1,000 ships or start a war between nations, but her rape accusation has started a “war” within a nation between races and classes, between men and women, between jocks and nerds, and most of all, between the truth and lies.
The Duke lacrosse rape case is everywhere. It’s hot. It sells. The word of one woman of questionable reputation, who takes off her clothes for a living and was drunk the night of the alleged rape, started this chain of events when she accused three white lacrosse players of raping her:
- Duke’s lacrosse team, with a record of 6-2, cancelled its entire season.
- The effects of the cancellation reverberated throughout the league.
- Lacrosse coach Mike Pressler resigned.
- With the lacrosse team hanging in suspended animation, recruits and other hopefuls will have to make other plans.
- Sophomore and player Ryan McFadyen was suspended because of an admittedly dumb e-mail about skinning black strippers (whether he was only referencing a book or not).
- District Attorney Mike Nifong is using the case as a political campaign to pander for black votes, assuring the press and angry blacks that DNA evidence would provide conclusive proof that the woman was raped by the white players. As it turned out, there was no DNA connection between the woman and the white players.
- Taxpayers’ money spent on this investigation will be wasted if allegations are false.
- Race relations, probably strained before, will be worse now. Race-baiting and racially-charged false accusations are bad for everyone.
- Radical, man-hating feminists emerged from the fringes to stir up dissention between the sexes and
castratecastigate all men, particularly young, white, “rich” lacrosse players at Duke. - The so-called victimization of women and dredging up of all kind of grievances — Because of one woman’s spurious allegations, victim stories are rolling off the presses. I mean, look at this mess. Victims are everywhere! (Whatever stereotypes whites may have about black women, BET is 1,000 times worse!.)
- The Jesse Jacksons and Al Sharptons, after an involuntary hiatus, seize the opportunity to generate press for cash.
Those are just obvious consequences. There are plenty more. What the DA should have done was focus on the three white alleged rapists instead of focusing on all 46 white players. He should not have held “forums” with black groups nor run his mouth on TV before he had evidence in hand.
If the stripper’s allegations are true, that three white lacrosse players raped her in the bathroom of the house that night, those involved deserve whatever happens. If not, our black Helen should be shunned for a time and made to suffer the consequences of her crimes. She should be brought to civil court and sued for defamation. Accusations of rape are serious, and little girls who cry wolf make it more difficult for the rest of us women to be taken seriously.
What happens next? Call the grand jury, hand down indictments, or toss out the case — the sooner this is over, the better. If anything interesting hits the news cycle today, I’ll update this post. In the meantime, check Google News.
Update: Race, race, race, race, race, race, race, race, race! It’s not going away, folks. It’s part of the human condition, consequences of The Fall. Just play along…
Update II : Latest news — Are the police trying to search dorm rooms without warrants? What have they found? Developing…
Liberal blogger Mark sees “privilege” at work.
Related posts:
(Who is Helen of Troy? Answer.)
(Painting by Evelyn de Morgan)
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It would seem that, if her blood was taken during the hospital visit, then we know if she was drunk, or on some kind of drugs. Does anyone know if the defense has the results from her rape exam? If so, I would think the defense would of made this public by now.
We don’t know for certain yet the facts of this case.
But, IF (and that’s an “IF”) there has been a false accusation made (and we don’t want to pass judgment before all the facts are in), then I think the following could apply :
“If a malicious witness takes the stand to accuse a man of a crime. . . and if the witness proves to be a liar, giving false testimony against his brother, then do to him as he intended to do to his brother. . . The rest of the people will hear of this and be afraid, and never again will such an evil thing be done among you.” (Deuteronomy 19.18ff )
Al Sharpton? I figured one of the Sinister Ministers would find a way to become involved….
“Sinister Ministers” I like that can I start using it, please
This is in reference to comments Fake Rape at Duke: Next Steps (Updated) Comment by Heliotrope — 04.13.06 @ 8:37 am
“Under this philosophy, rape is reduced to a case of ‘was there penetration with permission.’ But the ‘willing woman’ concept clouds the issue.”
Hi Heliotrope, I can only assume that you misunderstood the point I was trying to make. I was commenting on the notion that because young men have opportunities to have sex is unrelated to whether one would actually commit rape.
The former would imply that all men who do not have sexual partners are potential rapist. If however the latter is true and rape comes for a different desire, then we are safe to say rapists are demented sickos, not every random male out there.
I think the issue of consent has confused rape. We now live in a world were two drunk students have sex with each other. They wake up the next morning and decide drunk female is victim, and drunk male is rapist.
We have drifted from did she said no to did she say yes. We now live in a world were it is called rape if you did not get a yes, or in some cases, if she changes her mind during the act, and you do not stop soon enough.
I think the law has changed the definition to a point of meaninglessness. I do not think those strange new definitions work. I am going to continue believe it takes a certain kind of person to force sexual activity on another person. Just like, it takes a certain kind of person to be a serial killer.
If this DA drags out this thing without charges till election, we will know for sure what his motives are. If he files charges on Monday, we will know who is charged. I know one thing for sure. If I was falsely accused for political gain, there is no end to what I’d sue for. Unfortunately, that means I’d be suing every citizen of the city, since the city’s money comes from taxpayer dollars. I hope the good citizens of Durham realize that. Question..who has control of DA’s? Anybody?
I am very saddened by the horrific events at Duke. If a rape occurred, everyone involved should be prosecuted.
At this point, I strongly believe that the lacrosse players used a broomstick or some other object on her. This may explain why there is no DNA.
I also believe that it was premeditated. Ask yourself, why would a group of white men specifically request two black strippers? These men could have hired white, Asian or Latin women to dance, but they didn’t.
If these players were such good looking (highly sought after athletes, why did they need to hire strippers at all?? I think they had every intention of degrading/humiliating the stripper…not because she is a stripper but because she’s a black woman.
Ebony, I don’t know how old you are, but here’s something I’ve learned in almost-40 decades: men don’t hire strippers and prostitutes because they’re ugly or can’t get dates. Some people get off on the sleaze of it all. They could have the most sought-after, the most beautiful, most desirable and decent woman at home and still fantasize about nasty romps with nasty women.
Don’t forget also the privilege involved.
Why?
La Shawn,
My point is… they were obviously looking to degrade her.
These lacrosse players specifically hired two black strippers. It’s my overall belief that it was premeditated.
It’s all very sordid and really shows the level of these so called ‘elite’ athletes.
—-
This is off the topic but how many black strippers would actually ‘perform’ for a group of white athletes… without security.
This woman is from the south and I’m sure she is aware of the ‘legacy’ surrounding white male and black female interactions.
You know, a commenter on a previous post said he used to be a bouncer in college and worked private parties. The women would hire him to accompany them just in case they DIDN’T want to have sex (as if that were unusual) and the guys didn’t get the message.
I’d really like someone familiar with that lifestyle to give us some insight on the protocol.
Ebony, I’ve been following this very closely, and have not seen ANYWHERE that these guys “specifically hired two black strippers.” Do you have a link to a reputable source for that info? Is it possible they just called a stripper or escort service, and didn’t specify a race?
The co-stripper’s 911 call says she’s with her “black friend”, but do we even know if the co-stripper was black? I haven’t seen that either.
Ohhh…I forgot to address that point. I don’t think those guys hired black strippers specifically. One of the theories floating around is they were upset because black strippers showed up and they didn’t perform once they got there.
As a rape survivor I shudder as I read the demeaning comments made in the feeding frenzy against the alleged victim. If she’s a woman of no morals as many assert then the guys who hired her are also without morals.
If the alleged victim was raped (whether you ever believe her or not) then she didn’t set off the chain of events that sickens you, rapists did that.
Apparently only the purest of rape victims should report their rapes. The rest aren’t worth the trouble they create for their rapists.
Correction: only women who are RAPED should report rapes. I’m very sorry about what happened to you, Marcella, but people have and are entitled to express their opinions about this story. And the blog hostess has the privilege of blogging about this case the way she wants to blog about it. (Also, as a former drunk, I shudder to think what could have happened to me during a blackout. Actions have consequences.) - Admin
You should do a basic search of the early news articles. The NY times reported that Matt Zash, the captain of the lacrosse team contacted an escort service and requested the black strippers.
Let’s be honest. We live in a society in which race matters. Men interested in hiring strippers usually inform the agency of what they are seeking. Do you really believe that these guys agreed to pay a fee of $800.00 without specifically stating what they were looking for? More than likely the team captain asked the agency ( …do you have any black dancers? We are having a birthday party for a team member and wanted to hire two to perform… oh which team?? Ahh there will be around 5 guys from the duke track and baseball team)…
Duke’s track and baseball team have a significant number of black payers –which explains why the all white lacrosse team felt the need to lie about who they were.
Agencies would never send black women to perform for white men or white women to perform for black men unless the client specifically requested this. It goes against the norms of the industry. In general most agencies aim to please for repeat business.
People for some reason fail to understand this very important point… therefore I ask the question again, why would a group of white men specifically request two black strippers?
Something wonton was definitely in the works!
James,
Feel free to use it! If you’re blogging, just let people know where you heard it first.
Scott
The problem with all these so called high profile cases is they are tried in the media and the court of public opinion before all of the facts are known. Its funny how the presumption of innocences is used selectively based on the author’s agenda. Regardless of the outcome the so called new and old media will have a field day spinning it in the light most favorable them.
Wasn’t Kobe Bryant tried without any real evidence? In fact after he was accused, it was later determined that the ‘victim’ actually had sex with two white men (based on the DNA samples). The media was very silent about this finding.
Many people do not know that the ‘accuser’ sued Bryant in civil court and received a hearty pay cut.
This woman did not have any evidence that a rape actually occurred…yet a major celebrity was arrested and tried before the media. He was definitely presumed guilty in the eyes of the media and most white Americans.
Since he’s a wealthy athlete ripe for extortion or blackmail, I actually believed Koby’s version without question. I’m having a hard time believing these Duke allegations, though.
so many interesting comments to address…
Deuteronomy, eh? which also tells us that if a man rapes a virgin, he is required to marry her and pay the father 50 shekles. if a man rapes an engaged women in town, then the man is to be killed for rape and the woman too if she doesn’t cry out.
as for why black women? I don’t think too much can be read into that. guys like variety, so maybe they were cycling thru their favorites…asian, black, redheads, whatever.
lashawn - I admire your willingness to say what you believe and deal with the facts.
for some reason I have felt compelled to follow this case closely, and I am amazed at all the mis-information out there. while I think the team sounds like an astoundingly obnoxious group- drunken misbehavior, picking fights/assaulting people on the steets, racial slurs, crude, foolish in broadcasting hateful speech,disrespectful of their neighbors - I decided a while ago that the rape allegations didn’t really add up.
However, I wonder if they did get rough with the stripper when they quarreled over the money. obviously she was pissed- at the minimum it seems due to racial comments and over the money. hopefully it’s nothing more.
but if she is making most of it up, as it seems to me she has done a real disservice to so many groups.
wash, DC
#3 Seahawk - Great point. That would be a penalty which would significantly lighten the case load of a lot of courtrooms.
Back in the day, whether it was a bachelor party or just a big get together, if strippers were hired for any private party, it was because they were prostitutes too. It could be that some didn’t do that, but I never saw it any other way.
Somebody had sex with her/them.
I’d say that no matter what, it makes no sense to cancel the whole season when at most three people were involved in something, if something even happened. That’s just nuts.
As for jumping to conclusions about who is innocent or guilty — I certainly never jumped to that conclusion with Kobe Bryant. I wasn’t there, so I certainly didn’t know, but the idea that it was plain extortion certainly ran through my mind. I just figured a court would figure it out from whatever evidence was given. I didn’t assume he was guilty, or innocent, really.
In this case, I first heard about it because one of the players is the brother of an internet friend of mine. So I was definately rooting for them to be innocent, for her sake. But all in all, I’d think that had I been totally objective, I still would have been disgusted by the people assuming they were guilty. But then, I’m a big fan of presumed innocence and actually backing things up with actual evidence.
I really wonder if most would feel the same way if it was the duke (mostly black) basketball team accused of raping a white stripper.
I’m certain that the arrest warrants would have been issued without any DNA. In all honesty if a black man is accused of raping a white woman there is a heavy price to pay… If a white man rapes a black woman –no criminal charges or arrests are usually filed.
—–
And once again, the fact that these white men specifically requested two black strippers is very telling. Neighbors have stated that the players were shouting racial epithets…
These men didn’t hire the black strippers out of lust or for variety etc… They hired them specifically for the purpose of committing some type of sordid degrading act/crime.
I firmly believe that the lacrosse players sexually assaulted the woman. I just hope that women of color, specifically black women learn from this case.
Some suggest the woman has made a false rape accusation, because she is angry that she was not paid.
Why make the rape allegation? Why go to the hospital for an examination? Why not just report assault and theft? Why subject yourself to a vaginal examine — rape kit, and photos. Just charge assault and have the police take picture of your face and the scars on her knees. They searched the house found her property so she was robbed. She was even missing a size 6 white shoe.
From Probable Cause Affidavit:
“…the witness/co-worker stated the men at the party told her they were members of the Duke Baseball and Track Team…”
“In a non-custodial interview …Mr. Flannery admitted using an alias to make the reservation to have the dancers attend the Lacrosse Team Party….further interviews showed that. The players also used numbers…to hide their identities.”
Are not the men’s actions more suspicious? They call an escort service and ask for two dances for bachelor’s party with five attendees when in fact the party was for the men’s Lacrosse Team.
They men were lying from the very beginning in preparation for something. The women however, come to dance, leave the party, are coax to come back in the party and then 30 minutes they flee. (According to neighbor)
What is the woman’s motivation for lying about the rape? Lying so well that police took her to the hospital, and the Forensic Sexual Assault Nurse …”stated the injuries and her behavior were consistent with a traumatic experience.”
What can one possible say about the Kobe Bryant case? It was a classic — he said/she said. He admitted to the sex, and claimed it was consensual.
This case is starkly different, the woman is saying she was raped and the men are not admitting to sexual contact.
The Kobe Bryant case is the kind of case that does not belong in criminal court. The woman went to his room for a sexual encounter and then changed her mind during the act. Later still she decided it was rape.
It was a matter for the civil court where it was settle. There was no way a jury could have reached a verdict beyond a reasonable doubt. Not everything this is a criminal matter.
There has been one encouraging sign to come out of this incident. There has been an agreeable lack (so far) of widespread pompous “civil rights” posturing about how this proves that white men want to rape black women in order to to keep them living in fear and submission.
Frankly I had expected a tsunami of such garbage, but I have not seen it materialize yet.
I hate to reply. My son at Duke says that his frat brothers on the team did NOT hire black strippers, aka hookers. In fact, part of this whole story is the fact that the service sent a Mexican and a Black “escort”. The team had asked for White girls and when these “girls” showed up, they were not happy to begin with. Not to mention that the Black girl was completely screwed up. Why make the rape accusation, MONEY HONEY! Get a life, there are people out there that lie and steal for a living, like maybe people that hire themselves out as “escorts”. This is all about the girl thinking she is the next Rodney King. Why do you think they called in the fake hate crime “they yelled at us and called us N’s”. Didn’t happen, but it makes the race card come up immediately. This is all about CASH, AND and election! All over May 2nd.
Why make a false rape accusation? Well, since we’re speculating…
We know that about 2 years ago, this accuser was arrested for stealing a car from a guy for whom she was stripping, led police on a high-speed chase and then when she stopped and a cop got out, she tried to run him over. And we know that nothing was said about any rape in this case until she was in the back of the cop car, picked up for public drunkenness. Maybe she snapped out of her stupor enough to realize she had violated her probation, and claimed rape to avoid being booked, and then it just snowballed on her and now she can’t back out of it without being in MAJOR trouble?
This is just a wild guess, I admit. Another theory would be simple anger/revenge because the lacrosse team stiffed her on her fee, and maybe called her names. There could be a lot of reasons, and right now we just don’t know for sure if she’s telling the truth or not. But each piece of evidence that comes out seems to fit the players’ story, and not the accuser’s.
Still, although I’m in the camp of doubters, I don’t want to rush to judgment on the accuser, the way so many rushed to judge the players. She may really have been assaulted and/or raped at the house on Buchanon street. Or, if it’s true that she showed up there already injured, she may have been raped prior to showing up there, and in her shock and intoxication, got her story totally screwed up. Until we know everything, anything is possible! I hope the cops are checking her prior appointments from that night, and testing the DNA of those folks (if there were any prior appts.) All leads should be followed, not just those pointing toward the people you WANT to find guilty.
Ebony..
White men have fantasies about black women.
Black men have fantasies about white women.
White women have fantasies about black men.
Black women I don’t know. I haven’t had that knowledge shared.
So I wouldn’t think it odd that the Lacrosse team requested black strippers. But I read somewhere one of them was Hispanic. It’s hard to tell.
If you call and request just plain strippers, you will get whoever is ready. Race unimportant. You can request by type. $800 seems like a normal stripper fee. But an escort service seems like a prostitution service to me. So I am not clear as to exactly what these women were there to do. It suggests there were there to dance only, and sex was a side bet if both sides were willing.
If anything society is cracking down too hard on the woman for wanting to dance and have sex in return for money. It’s a pretty harmless act and serves a social function. She’s a stripper, so what? She is probably smarter than half the people at Duke. She does sound a little messed up as a person though. But I imagine that she is a little better than half the members of the Lacrosse team.
To pull race into this equation is pretty silly. It’s good time to cull the white racists and black racists out of the equation and tell them they are useless.
The DA needs unelecting.
The DUKE president needs to fall on his own sword like he asked the whole Lacrosse team to do. He is incompetent as a leader. It is the weak black and white leaders that let these things get racially out of hand. Replace them.
Ellen,
hiring a stripper still has an unreasonable stigma in our puritan society. All men will tell the Clintonian lie in this situation to avoid potential problems with their own familiars.
Kemp.. I agree. Money is the very most important issue here. There was not a meeting of the wallets and then the race cards were pulled out as threats. It will be interesting to see actual testimony and time lines of both sides.
I think she did have a bad sexual experience that night among other things. At what time that occurred I don’t know. It could easily be a college student. College students full of alcohol have extremely poor poor judgment. That last part should be obvious to everyone, but it’s not enough to fire the lacrosse team. The whole student body is probably guilty. As evidence I assert springbreaks and the “girls gone wild” videos.
why claim rape if it didn’t happen?
well, why call 911 and concoct a story to get the guys in trouble?
assuming it was one of the strippers who called (a safe bet) in the first 911 call they gave a variety of versions of a story, none of which reflect what actually happend. they weren’t walking by, driving by or sitting on the stoop.
3 separate sources now say the alledged victim was very drunk (the players, the kroger security guard that made the 2nd 911 call, and the police officer who answered that call.) if she was highly intoxicated, there is no reason to wonder what rational thought processes went into her “plan”. very possibly she was pissed off, too drunk to think clearly, and had no idea what she was setting into motion. at some point she would relaize she can’t back out of the story.
have you followed the changes in the crimestopper blotter? they changed it several times to downplay how they describe the crime. clearly the police ar erecognizing that the case is a lot mor eproblematic than they first thought.
as for the players- they sound like real jerks, but really I doubt they schemed to bring a black dancer to their house to attack her. and the disgusting, badly timed email talking about killing strippers- does anyone one really thing that the email is to be taken at face value? i don’t blame the cops for taking it seriously- i guess they have to (it’s like making a bomb joke at the airport- the guards have to treat it as real.) but it’s absurd to think the guy actually intended to invite strippers to his dorm room and kill them.
as for robbing the women. are we to believe that was premediatated too? they hired women so that they could give them money and steal it back? errr, umm, whatever….
the finger nails, and lost stuff are both easy to explain if there was an argument, a tussel over the money, or the woman was fall-down drunk. it certainly doesn’t prove rape. nor does any bruising she may have shown up with, gotten falling down, or being man-handled in a dispute over money. I do wonder if there is a chance the charge willl be assualt instead of rape….
“At this point, I strongly believe that the lacrosse players used a broomstick or some other object on her. This may explain why there is no DNA.”
Wouldn’t she have told the police that a foreign object was used? In which case, they wouldn’t have bothered to test for DNA - it’s a pretty expensive process to rush results through that quickly and, from what I understand, most police departments simply don’t have the resources to waste on something like that if they know they won’t get a result.
I would like to second La Shawn’s assertion that men don’t hire strippers because they can’t get a woman. Often, especially with college-age guys, hiring a stripper is a kind of male-bonding thing. It was the same when groups of women used to go and see the Chippendales - 99% of the time, it wasn’t because they wanted to have sex, that just wasn’t on the agenda. The point was to have a girlie laugh together.
If a rape did occur, again, it definitely wasn’t because these guys couldn’t get laid any other way. Rape is about power. I’m a rape survivor, and my attacker was very good-looking, popular, and a hit with most women (just not with me, which is why he did it: he couldn’t take the rejection).
(Ellen - I’ve got to say this, just because the police found the girl’s property in the house doesn’t mean she was robbed. By all accounts she was wasted, and I know from experience, many times, that when one is that drunk/stoned/whatever, one tends to leave things lying around.)
Hey, is it me or am I alone in shaking my head at all the speculation since the MSM is known to be untrustworthy.
I’m waiting for the all the evidence to played out either in the investigation and/or the subsequent trial.
I was watching an MSNBC report, and the reporter stated that the defense had shown him the pictures. He described the pictures vividly.
Based on his description, one of the pics show that she was completely passed out. My guess is, they put something in her drink…which completely knocked her out.
The reporter stated that her size 6 high heeled shoe was missing from her foot.. and she looked completely disoriented.
Therefore my guess is, after they put the drug in her drink…they assaulted her with objects anally and vaginally (which would explain the tearing reported by the nurse specialist and physician and the lack of DNA evidence).
Another note…
You are really being dishonest if you don’t believe that these guys specifically requested black strippers. No agency would ever send blk strippers to entertain a group of white men, without being instructed to do so. Further more.. men that hire strippers are very specific about what they want.
This issue is very important because it will help the prosecution show that it was premeditated. They intended to do harm.
Those duke athletes did not request white strippers…I’m sure they wouldn’t have to pay any white woman on campus or off to show up and entertain them…
The point is, they wanted to do some wonton act to a person of color –specifically to a black woman. It was evil and wicked!
I will not comment of Ebony’s delusions, she obviously has made up her mind that the Hooker has a golden heart. My son returned home for Easter, here is the latest from campus. The DA has NO idea who was or wasn’t at the party. He sent detectives to campus on Thursday to try and get the players to tell them who was there. They refused. All 46 team members were tested, but a very LARGE number of the team members did NOT attend the party. Rumor has it that the “victim” has fingered a team member as her attacker that was NOT even at the party. I guess that will put a end to the story. The supposed rapist can prove he was in NYC that weekend. I guess he was looking for Tawana Brawley! I hope these boys sue EVERYONE involved in this liberal witch hunt. The DA is also refusing to turn over video of his interview with the “victim” a clear violation of his legal obligations in the case. The boy’s lawyers are ALL over him. He’s going down.
Good don’t comment on my statements…
You fail to realize that this is really nothing new…but would certainly set a precedence if a conviction actually occurred.
I don’t believe that any white men have ever been actually ‘convicted’ by a jury for raping a black woman…
What does this say about our legal system? A few years ago there was a case at saint john’s university… Apparently a black female student had gone to a party and reported that she was raped by 5 white men at the school. There was never any denial by the defense that the 5 men had sex with her.. (yes there was DNA evidence) the issue was whether it was consensual..
Guess what.. all 5 were acquitted.. The all white jury didn’t convict them! Why?? well we all know that black women are whores and can’t be raped… right?
However history tells me that this is not the case. Both of my parents are black… and the same applies for my cousins.. however I always marvel at the variety of skin shades within my own family.
I am from the north…but recently I went to the south for a family reunion.. a very distant cousin showed me pics from way back (these pics were so ancient that they were brown and chipped around the edges, she had plastic covering some of them….
I was however surprised to see one image which showed a woman that was of dark complexion holding her two sons (both of her sons were very light).. in another pic I saw the woman’s husband. He was actually darker than the woman…
It was very eerie.. a pic is really worth a thousand words… I wonder how did this woman get the fair skinned child.. and all of the other ‘countless’ blk women that produced these mixed children… I’m willing to bet that 99.99% of those women didn’t consent.
So once again…this is nothing new…
It is a frustrating truth that certain accusations destroy the accused even if they are utterly false and disproven. Accuse someone of rape, child abuse, incest, sexual harassment… and their career usually is destroyed, their reputation gone, and they are forever viewed in that light, rather than all they’ve done otherwise and the fact that these accusations were false.
Consider the clever trick played on J. Edgar Hoover. One person says he wore women’s clothing and some blurry pictures show up… and that’s what people remember and joke about forever after. Was it true? Personally I doubt the most paranoid man on earth in charge of an army of investigators would let himself be photographed by his maid in a dress, but putting that aside… nobody cares if it’s true or not, they want it to be. The man’s memory is forever tarnished by this episode.
Hoover was a miserable jerk in a lot of ways, a power hungry manipulating blackmailer, but I’d rather he be denounced for that rather than a really doubtful smear.
“At this point, I strongly believe that the lacrosse players used a broomstick or some other object on her. This may explain why there is no DNA.”
Incidentally… there was DNA. Just not any that matches any of the players on the LaCrosse team that she accused.
Even a broomstick would of left some kind of evidence behind. If they have a broomstick with DNA on it, then that is damning, if they have it also on the woman from the broomstick then that is damning, this stuff is easy to prove. So lets just see…
I personally think this woman did not get raped in that house, she came out of that bathroom high and drunk, and forgot her stuff in that house. But she went in that bathroom on her own and alone.
A few comments…
1. it is entirely concievable and probable that they did NOT request black strippers. Can be answered by an interview of the agencies, which DA would have done if he were tring to pursue a hate crime/race-related motive. He surely would have made that interview public if that were he case.
2. you can request but you don’t always get what you want. I have been to many bachelor parties (funny its the married guys that love them) over the years and one in Myrtle Beach, SC (3 hours from Durham) comes to mind where the strippers requested were two white redheads (the bachelor’s fiance was a redhead - sick joke by best man). A raven haired pierced goth chick (too white in fact) and an indian girl showed up, despite assurance of the request ebing filled. (They also were two hours late, from an earlier call).
3. this is Durham, NC not NYC or Atlanta, etc. so I’m sure there was slim pickin’. This is supported by the fact they called two agencies.
4. neither the strippers, nor the agencies knew there were as many men as there were.
5. this whole incident had nothing to do with race. It is about money, alcohol/drugs (my guess sniffing/smoking/shooting heorin…like movie Traffic), insults and a very unhealthy lifestyle.
6. if there was a rape, it was not about race. Calling someone “Sister” does mean it was racial motivated. until the money issue came up
7. if there was a rape it is absurd to think they did it without a condom. Aside from her escort job, with the bruises and her behavior, this girl had a big aids warning goin off. These supposed rich whities would not risk that.
8. Sex & money….not race. If you want to make a whore moan, don’t pay her.
Good Blog you have La Shawn! I noticed it at Tom Bevan’s Real Clear Politics, though I had seen another day or so of your stuff from a link I’ve now forgotten….about 3 months ago.
I am retaining an open mind on this, while offer some observations and questions:
1. As a white college educated jock, I’ve attended parties where strippers were “part of the show”. Mostly white strippers, but I can say that a good-looking, non-skanky Asian or black stripper was hardly an unwelcome sight. I do note we had GFs at a few of those parties that were not batchelor stag parties. I believe that if you extend the statistics to the whole male population, a majority have been at stags or been in a strip club. Which better not make them all evil victimizers and criminals! Despite what “men are evil” feminists claim. Now, at private parties I attended, the hired strippers were always accompanied by a bodyguard/driver from the agency that helped check the situation out, laid out the ground rules (no touching, no abusive language, tipping method, no drugs - or they’re out. Who holds the money, and what sex acts the stripper might do on the side for what rate to the best man, etc. ) I find the lack of driver/bodyguard, lack of ground rules unusual.
2. If a stripper had shown up too drugged up or drunk to perform, a refund and a stoppage of the contracted performance is in order. We had to do that at two parties I remember, and at one, the drunk stripper told she wouldn’t get paid because she was unfit to work became belligerant and began hitting people before the driver tossed her in a car..though the driver did negotiate something for time and trouble though he agreed not full fee because that would be a rip-off. It was confrontational.
3. Although race became so big in this one, I see the PC story that women are victims, men are predators as the initial mindset the accuser, as in the Kobe case, presumed to be telling the truth by those who believe in the PC mental meme. And race and class privilege not driving the assumption that the side possessing penises must be guilty. Because stuff happens, or could happen - whether you believe the woman or the guys - anytime you toss sexual themes, booze, and young people into the same small space. Regardless of race and class.
4. I believe that false accusations that profoundly affect innocent accused lives should be treated as criminal acts. A false accusation for a major felony like murder, rape, grand theft, child molestation should be a major felony itself. Anyone planting evidence should be prosecuted for a felony. And their faces plastered everywhere as liars. Just an minor misdemeanor & restitution penalty isn’t enough in many cases where you are talking about lives and reputations ruined, jail time unjustly served, and tremendous legal costs for the accuser’s victim. And many of the false accusers lack the money to pay.
5. If there was rape and many not involved covered it up, they should be given jail under conspiracy laws.
excuse the many typos in 42 it was written too fast
Duke lacrosse players refused police interviews
By Associated Press | April 15, 2006
DURHAM, N.C. — Police tried to interview Duke University lacrosse players at their dorm rooms about the team party where a woman reported being raped, but the athletes refused to speak with investigators, an attorney for several players said yesterday…….
Talking about a misleading headline!!! All players have attorneys!!! Of course they refused to be interviewed without attorneys. The police’s action was wrong at so many levels legally it is ridiculous!!!
There no shame in the world any more. This ends “means justify ends” mantra of the press is sickening.
“here’s something I’ve learned in almost-40 decades”
—-
Dang, you old!
Dear LaShawn,
I want to take this time, just before Easter, to thank you for your support of the Duke players and the school. It appears that I am the only commenter that has a direct connection to the situation, and behalf of all of the Duke Families, THANKS! and HAPPY EASTER!
P.S. Also, on most blogs (deleted) Ebony would be flamed into silence, thanks for letting her make a fool of herself. Kemp
Thanks, kemperman, but part of the reason people are free to discuss things here is that I don’t allow commenters to call each other names.
By the way, I’ll send you an e-mail about your direct connection to this mess. If possible, I’d like to track down and post exclusive information. - Admin
Just so people can gain a little perspective about RAPE on College campuses:
>>>”Statistics on College Rape
One out of four women will be sexually assaulted on a college campus. 1
One out of eight women will be raped while in college. 2
84% of women who were raped knew their assailant. 3
57% of rapes occur on a date. 4
75% of male students and 55% of female students involved in date rape had been drinking or using drugs. 5″
1 Hirsch (1990). National Victims Center. Retrieved August 16, 2000, from the World Wide Web: http://www.ncvc.org/ index.html
2 Martin, Laura C. (1992). A Life Without Fear. Nashville: Rutledge Hill Press, 71. Retrieved August 15, 2000, from the World Wide Web: http://www.uga.edu/~safecampus/statistics.html
3 National Victims Center (1992). Retrieved August 15, 2000, from the World Wide Web: http://www.uga.edu/~safecampus/statistics.html
4 Koss, Woodruff (1990). Koss Study. Retrieved August 15, 2000, from the World Wide Web: http://www.uga.edu/~safecampus/statistics.html
5 Koss, M.P. (1998). Hidden Rape: Incidence, Prevalence and Descriptive Characteristics of Sexual Aggression and Victimization in a National Sample of College Students. In Burgers, A.W. (ed.) Sexual Assault, Vol. II. New York: Garland Publishing Co. Retrieved August 15, 2000, from the World Wide Web: http://www.uga.edu/~safecampus/statistics.html
Need More?
>>>”In studies in the early 1980s and 1990s, approximately one-third of college men reported they would rape a woman if they knew they would not get caught…
…College athletes are disproportionately reported to campus judicial officers for acquaintance rape.56 It is unclear whether they actually offend more, or whether students tend to report them more (perhaps angered by athletes’ esteemed and privileged status). On some campuses, revenue-generating athletes (usually footballFootball
American football and basketball players) may believe they are immune to campus rules (and sometimes are), and take advantage of “groupies” or other women they perceive as sexually interested in them.57
As for fraternities, a disproportionate number of documented gang rapes involve fraternityFraternity
An organization of male college or university students that is formed primarily for social reasons and has a name consisting of Greek letters members. Research on reported gang rapes committed by college students from 1980 to 1990 found that fraternity members committed 55 percent of them.58 Fraternities often have a unique place on campus; they are typically housed in private residences (with many private rooms) and hold large unsupervised parties, often with free-flowing alcohol. Some fraternity members approve of getting a woman drunk to have sex. This, combined with some fraternities’ emphasis on loyalty above identifying members who rape, has put fraternities in the center of controversy because a disproportionate number of reported rapes occur on their property. A number of researchers believe that certain fraternities, because of their practices, are more rapeprone†than others, placing sororitySorority
An organization of female college or university students that is formed primarily for social reasons and has a name consisting of Greek letters members (and other frequent women attendees at fraternity parties) at greater risk of rape. Some researchers also believe that binge drinking makes certain fraternities high risk for rape. Many national Greek organizationsGreek Organization
A Greek letter fraternity or sorority now require education for their local chapters concerning sexual assault and alcohol consumption, and some now mandate “dry” houses.”"
Reasons I can believe something like this could happen
Of course, just like EVERYBODY ELSE posting on this subject, I don’t know what happened at that party, but I know by STATISTICS, it’s possible that this type of crime could have occurred.
My question to those defaming this accuser is why, given the statistics on college rape, are you holding the Duke Lacrosse team or anybody else who was at that house as somehow INCAPABLE of this.
–Cobra
Jesse Jackson and his rainbow push coalition have agreed to fund the victim’s full college education
regardless of the outcome of the case.
I am elated with this recent report. It is my hope that his organization also pay for her graduate school studies once she completes her undergrad degree from NCC. FYI: She was not a part-time student, she is a full time student and it’s been reported that her GPA was good.
It is my ultimate hope that she turns to God for guidance and awareness. She should quit the stripping nonsense and get a job doing something constructive. No woman should ever have to degrade herself in that fashion. I am especially dismayed that she felt the need to put herself in such a dangerous situation.
I plan to send some money to the rainbow coalition for this woman’s children…. from my understanding a trust fund is being established. I love to hear about the positive and not the negative.
Why girls go wild in college.
The short answer? Not enough men.
It also explains the prevalence of out of wedlock births. Again - the desire for procreation is stronger than the desire for marriage (esp. if there is a lack of quality men)
C. Taylor,
Hoover had a problem.
Clyde Tolson.
It wasn’t just the dress style he prefered.
Cobra, I can’t speak for anybody else, but I will say that I certainly think the lacrosse players COULD be capable of such a crime. Frankly, I don’t see any post at all that says or even implies that they could NOT be capable of such a crime. I think most people have grown to distrust the accuser’s story because of the lack of ANY DNA on her and because of the inconsistencies in the 911 calls and the fact that she never mentioned any rape to her co-stripper and only started saying rape once she was under arrest (or at least detained by the cops).
Just as it would be silly to claim that these jocks couldn’t commit rape, it would be silly to claim that this accuser couldn’t lie. Given the fact that she’s known to be capable of a) stealing a car, b) leading cops on a high-speed chase, and c) trying to run over a cop…certainly she’s CAPABLE of lying. I’m not saying she is lying, because we don’t have all the evidence yet, but it’s certainly possible and the weight of the evidence released so far tends to make me think she’s lying. Frankly, I admit that I hope she’s lying. I don’t want to think that a rape occurred. I do see some commentators that really seem to HOPE that she’s telling the truth, and that makes me furious. They hope she got raped? Damn, people, step back and think about your own motivations!
Its odd to me reading these comments.
there appears to be a divide between “they did it” which is based on resentment and ideology and “they didn’t do it” which is based on evidence as we have it in front of us.
Which of those is more reasonable a basis for judgement, do you think? The Menendez brothers and OJ juries took the first for their verdict.
Re: racial issues
From Durham Sun…
The situation, in fact, sends several mixed signals, said Kwami Imani, a student at Durham Technical Community College.
“I do believe, like a lot of people, that if the [racial] roles were reversed, it would be different,” Imani said. “At the same time, if it turns out she [the alleged victim] was lying — it could go both ways,” he said.
Nor does he see the case as necessarily causing racial division.
“No, the race thing is not like it used to be,” he said. “To me, rape is rape. It doesn’t matter if it’s a black person does it or a white person does it.”
EXACTLY!!
Whether is occured or not is another discussion.
Looks like Jesse Jackson is now going to do his exploitation of this case for his publicity and money…here we go!!
Cobra–those statistics are highly contested and many have been disproved. Many of those studies are unsound.
I think we need to wait for more evidence to come out, but I’m finding this situation dubious overall. I don’t think stripping is a harmless act–it degrades women and women degrade themselves. No one’s life will be better for it. I hope that whatever happens, both sides learn they need to shape up and keep themselves out of such questionable situations in the future. You can’t expect to engage in degradation of yourself or someone else and emerge unaffected.
so what with my last post and still waiting for my email. NO happy. Kemp
also tired, NOT happy
not no
I am sorryi #48 this is not Duke, maybe your local Communty college, no rapes at Duke in at leasts 10 years. Last rape date given to you tuesday, I am betting 20 years. NO Students raping ANYONE. Kemp
There is nothing degrading about stripping in and of itself. It is the personal mind that projects the degradation. The viewer if having that feeling is then the one participating in that thought process and making it part of oneself.
Stripping is just an illusion of sexual energy.
OK. Time to close this thread, I think… - Admin
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