Earlier this year, during all the big illegal immigration rallies, I was talking to my dad, who teaches history at a local high school. He was explaining to me about the cultural class system that developed in the Spanish colonies back in the day, and how that is still reflected in those countries today. Spaniards brought slaves to the New World, and there were natives when the Spanish arrived. The Spaniards (white Europeans) were the top dogs in the status heirarchy. Then, the I think the slaves were followed by the natives. To complicate matters, there became mixed-race members of the society. You could move down the social ladder, but you could never move up. The people you see sneaking into the US aren’t the pure-blood descendants of the white European Spaniards – they are the descendants of the natives, slaves, and mixed-blood Mestizo – those that are still at the bottom on the social heirarchy today. Until Mexico fixes that problem, we are going to continue to see large numbers of Mexican crossing into the US illegally.

Of course they are…the problem, of course, is that each is a reflection of just one small smidgeon of Mexican culture, and since we assume that if you’re Mexican, you want to live there, and since they are moving here, the reflection is somewhat distorted. They have a problem if they have decided to come here, but are not planning to become citizens – they’re neither Mexican nor American. Neither fish nor fowl, as they say. They have no real loyalty except to themselves and to heck with everyone else. In that respect, they reflect some of the worst aspects of _any_ culture. They need to make a choice and live with it. Either stay in Mexico and fight to make their country better, or stay here and become American. It’s hard to learn English – I can appreciate someone who doesn’t do it well, but who is trying – but to march in the streets demanding the rights of citizenship along with demands that their “rights” be “respected” … well, I can only say “look to your own country and how they treat _their_ illegal immigrants”.

I did read where the middle and upper class Mexicans resent the Mexicans living in the U.S. (legally or illegally) because they think they are giving Mexicans a bad name. How much of our perception of Mexicans/Hispanics come only from what we see and learn from the illegal immigrants? Are they an accurate reflection of Mexicans culture? What do you think?

None of that matters, though. This is not about middle class Mexicans living in Mexico. It’s about our United States of America. If you come here through proper immigration procedures, learn our language, adopt our cultural mores, obey our laws, then you can avail yourself of all the opportunities here. Otherwise, go back where you came from.

I mean, here in the metropolitan Detroit (Michigan) area home of the largest concentration of Arab speaking people in the U.S., home to large concentrations of Hispanics, Chaldeans, Polish, Russians and who knows who else, there are many places where you can go and hear little or no english! It’s annoying. You’d think that regular, english speaking Americans were on a slippery slope to extinction.

These statements sure seem contradictory to me.

Personally, I criticize “the Hispanic culture” because they ignore our laws, and seem not to want to become “Americans”, but would rather be Mexicans living in the USA in any way it suits them, while using every means possible to avail themselves of our largesse.
If they want to become citizens, they need to learn to speak the language, and obey _our_ laws. We should adopt _their_ laws letter for letter on the legal restrictions on non-citizens. If they assimilate, they’re welcome, but if they just want to inhabit this country without paying the “dues” one pays as a citizen, then let them go back where they came from.

“Mexico is, by any definition, a mess. The reasons that it is a mess stem directly from the flaws inherent in the culture of the Mexican people.”

What does that mean? Inherent flaws?

Mexicans don’t believe in abortion. Mexico has one of the lowest divorce rates in the world; a lot lower than that of the U.S. Are these inherent flaws?

Mexico has the 13th largest GDP. Mexico has a large middle class. The standard of living in Mexico is one of the highest in Latin America. Are these inherent flaws?

Mexico is a very complex culture with strong family values. In Mexico, family units are more close knit than in the U.S. Are these inherent flaws?

Yes, there is political upheaval in Mexico. Yes, there is a lot of poverty in Mexico. Perhaps these are the inherent flaws?

Maybe you can edify me by elucidating on the inherent flaws.

Are you critizing Hispanic culture because of the poverty? Because they come to America in droves seeking economic wealth? Maybe you don’t like the fact that they are 90% Catholic? I don’t know what your motivation is, but if you’re a seeker of truth, surf the net on Mexico. Surf here and here or wherever, then come back and clarify your statements.

Just because America is the rich superpower of the world doesn’t mean that America is the most righteous. Except that since America is on top, it gets to “define” what is righteous.

“Hence the reason why black americans of caribbean extraction fare better than other blacks. It isn’t because “whitey” decided to treat one group of black people whose grandparents came from Jamaica differently from another group whose grandparents came from Georgia.”

Well, the blacks in the carribean came from the same African cultures as the blacks in the U.S. So cultural differences today stem from what happened “yesterday” after blacks first arrived in the Americas.

There are many experts who posit that the different treatment by “whitey” of slaves in the carribean and South America and slaves in North America led to cultural differences in our time. Personally, I think it’s much more complex than that, but racist behavior then and now is a factor to be dealt with along with a myriad of other factors.

If you are a seeker of truth who wants to engage in an honest, intellectual discussion, go to your local library and check out Inhuman Bondage by Pulitzer Prize winning author David Brion Davis. You may or may not find support for your theories.

“I’m sure I’ll still be called a racist, but then that is to be expected, even if it is disappointing. As an intellectually honest person, I often assume that others are motivated by a similar pursuit of the truth. But I’m old enough now to know that very few on the left are motivated by anything so noble.”

“The lady doth protest too much, methinks.”

(I didn’t notice if you’re male or female, I just like that quote.)

Diversity = blacks, hispanics, and these days, muslims.

Diversity = victims of some sort. Underdogs – even if it’s their own fault.

Diversity means being able to claim that you are able to raise up the “great unwashed” of the world.

Jesus said: “The poor you will always have with you.” The liberals want to prove Him wrong.

Now here’s the deal…the child was born and raised in the Middle East (not Asia), had Indian parents who were American citizens, attended high school in American boarding schools, was a gifted pianist and talented in other ways, was brilliant, spoke a number of languages, had traveled the world, scored extremely high on her SATs, and had a 4.0+…

If it was diversity that Berkeley truly wanted, she absolutely exemplified that quality. So, what do schools mean when they say that they want diversity?

From what I understand, in California the bureaucrats within the UC system have worked out ways to continue engaging in racial discrimination in direct violation of state law. But imagine if they didn’t have any clue what color or sex an applicant was? Obviously if someone is named Barbara they’re going to know that this person is female, but what about a name like Taylor? The explosion of non-traditional names among members of Gen-Y means that much of the time you’re not going to know what their sex is if all you hear is a name. A person’s race is even more difficult to determine from their name. For every black dude named “Tyrone” there are dozens with names that aren’t associated with being black. The only favored group whose ethnicity is easy to determine from their name is hispanics. If admissions departments do discriminate in favor of people with spanish surnames, it will be easy to detect.

If you want to end discrimination in university admissions, denying the racist bureaucracy access to information about race is a very good place to start. Of course replacing that bureaucracy with new blood would be even better.

Lee

That’s kinda how I read it. If I’m wrong, edub, please correct me.

First, congratulations on such a great undergrad record and on getting admitted to the PhD programs!

But — why should affirmative action be alive in graduate school at all? (And why should it be “like cake” to get into undergraduate just because you’re black? But that’s another topic…)

Shouldn’t we be on a level playing field by grad school? Don’t you think your grades, test scores, recommendations and interviews should be enough? Why should you get an extra edge for your race and sex? By grad school, you should be competing strictly on your merits.

Why are you so sure your race worked against you? PhD programs are highly competitive. You did well to get into three of them! It’s not always about race, you know. Sometimes, it’s just about — you.

I have no doubt that many here, even a few conservatives, will read what I just wrote and feel the urge to call me a racist. Stop and think for a minute. Do you really believe that my words are motivated by bigotry? Is there no room for honest criticism where issues of race are concerned? This is not even an issue of race in the first place, but of culture. Different cultures are, surprise surprise, different. The values and norms that some instill create behaviors that result in better outcomes than those instilled by other cultures. Hence the reason why black americans of caribbean extraction fare better than other blacks. It isn’t because “whitey” decided to treat one group of black people whose grandparents came from Jamaica differently from another group whose grandparents came from Georgia. Such things are not known to anyone, and wouldn’t matter if they were. It all comes down to what the children are taught at home, and what values they pick up from their peers. If the culture that child comes from is not conducive to success, then that child is unlikely to succeed. The school they go to is a secondary issue at best.

Racism exists of course, but so does every other form of bigotry and discrimination. Sometimes people are going to dislike you for reasons that have nothing to do with who you are. Sometimes these people will be in a position to impede you and make your life more difficult. Sometimes you will be unfairly discriminated against, and this applies to people of both sexes and colors, creeds and religions. Discrimination can hold someone back, but what it cannot do is determine their worth as a person. The correct answer to racism and other forms of discrimination is not to whine and call for preferential treatment. The correct answer is to be a better person, to be better than those who would deny you, to hold yourself to a higher standard than they are capable of achieving. A person who succeeds in doing this cannot be done-in by the cruelty of those around them. Its like they say, you can’t keep a good man down.

I’m sure I’ll still be called a racist, but then that is to be expected, even if it is disappointing. As an intellectually honest person, I often assume that others are motivated by a similar pursuit of the truth. But I’m old enough now to know that very few on the left are motivated by anything so noble. To them I am a racist, a term so worn and abused that it has lost all meaning beyond its usefullness as an incantation against the specter of honest discussion.

Lee