Tuesday, June 19: Mike Nifong is a true idiot. After being disbarred, he had the nerve to announce he’d remain in office for another four weeks (to collect more money and build up his pension)! The man has been stripped of his license to practice law! He’s a disgrace. Fortunately not everyone is disgraceful. The judge said, “Get out now.” Today, the sheriff served the suspension order and took his badge and office keys.
Monday, June 18: As you know, it’s not over for Nifong. He could face criminal contempt charges and civil lawsuits. The reason things have gotten this bad for Nifong is that he pushed forward a case in which he couldn’t place the accused men at the scene of the so-called crime (in fact, there was no evidence a crime even occurred), hadn’t spoken to the accuser until months after the indictments, intentionally misrepresented evidence, intentionally withheld evidence, and used the case to campaign for office. If he was inexperienced and overwhelmed trying a felony case of this magnitude, he should have asked for help, guidance, something.
Nifong merely is reaping what he’s sown for the past year, and it’s no one’s fault but his own. Check out my Townhall column, Nifong’s Swan Song.
I forgot to mention this yesterday. I believe all three former Duke lacrosse players testified at Nifong’s hearing last week. I read an account of Reade Seligmann’s testimony. He was the only white student in an “African American” studies course. After the accusations, his study partner gave him the cold shoulder and wrote an article about how the sexual assault of a black woman by white men signifies the return of the Jim Crow south, or some such BS. This kind of ignorance flourishes when admissions standards are lowered.
Add these books to your reading list:
- Until Proven Innocent: Political Correctness and the Shameful Injustices of the Duke Lacrosse Rape Case
- It’s Not About the Truth: The Untold Story of the Duke Lacrosse Rape Case and the Lives It Shattered
Update (3:03 p.m): Just caught this. Reade Seligmann, the formerly indicted-for-rape lacrosse player with the alibi, says he, Collin Finnerty, and Dave Evans plan to sue Nifong. Good move. File suit against Duke University while you’re at it…
Later…Ha! Just found out via KC Johnson that Duke U has settled with Seligmann, Finnerty, and Evans. Hmmm…how much? 
Even later…And criminal charges, too? Better put Nifong on suicide watch…
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The thing is done. It’s almost anti-climactic.
Former Durham County District Attorney Michael B. Nifong has been stripped of his law license. After a week-long trial and a tearful non-apology apology, Nifong saw his legal career go up in proverbial flames.
Yesterday afternoon, a three-member disciplinary panel found Nifong guilty of lying, misrepresenting evidence, and making inflammatory statements to the media, and they disbarred him.
History professor and blogger KC Johnson blogged from the week-long ethics hearing last week. (Johnson is the co-author of Until Proven Innocent: Political Correctness and the Shameful Injustices of the Duke Lacrosse Rape Case.)
On Friday, Nifong offered a tepid apology: “To the extent that I made judgments that ultimately proved to be incorrect, I apologize to the three students that were wrongly accused” and resigned as DA: “My community has suffered enough… It has become apparent, during the course of this week, in some ways that it might not have been before, that my presence as the district attorney in Durham is not furthering the cause of justice.”
From the Raleigh News and Observer:
At the end of the five-day hearing, Williamson struggled to explain the self-destruction of Nifong, who has spent his 28-year legal career as a Durham prosecutor.
“Why, why did we get to the place we got?” Williamson asked. “At the root of it is self-deception arising out of self-interest. … His self-interest collided with a very volatile mix of race, sex and class, a situation which if it were a plot in a John Grisham novel would be considered to be too contrived.”
According to [Disciplinary Hearing Commission Chairman] Williamson, Nifong grabbed hold of the case in the middle of a hotly contested election campaign. Escort service dancer Crystal Gail Mangum said she was raped by three men at a lacrosse team party. Nifong immediately went on a media blitz without reading police reports, talking with Mangum or waiting for DNA tests. Nifong asserted a racially-motivated assault occurred and labeled players “hooligans.”
The case crumbled, but Nifong continued to press on.
Nifong, desperate to win election in a heavily black city, used the only ammunition at his disposal: a phony, high profile gang rape case bubbling over with race and class tension.
If I were Reade Seligmann, Collin Finnerty, and Dave Evans, I’d sue Duke University, the Durham Police Department, and Mike Nifong.
News round-up at The Johnsville News.
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One thing that continues to trouble me, and yet is seldom addressed by liberal posters, is the reelection of Nifong whose approval rate was pathetic before the election, and yet he seemed to have been reelected based upon his willingness to “hang without sufficient evidence – three privileged white boys. At the time Nifong was actually voted upon, there was already enormous evidence of malfeasance, lying, withholding of critical evidence, and yet this city voted for this man. What does this say about the corrupted attitudes of the residents of Durham?
Kinda late on this one aren’t you??
Who say theres no justice in the world? District Attorney Mike Nifong was stripped of his law license Friday by the North Carolina State bar disciplinary committee. I wish I could say that my heart bleeds for him, but it doesn’t and for good reason I’ve never hidden the fact that I have a high intolerance for people who use race to divide America either out of brainwashed ignorance or for political gain. Nifong performed the latter. Funny how the New Black Panther came to the defense of the lying stripper, but didn’t bother showing up to help out Mike Nifong. Didn’t Mr. Nifong supposedly shared their cause? I guess alliances among race baiters run very thin these days. Nifong had an idea what was coming down the pike so to speak, so he tried to head off the disciplinary committee at the pass by resigning as District Attorney. At the time it wouldn’t have been no big deal because he would have still been able to keep his law license and practice law. Well that strategy backfired on him. When a person a person of authority would try to destroy innocent people’s lives just to advance their political ambitions, that person deserves to have the weight of the legal Judaical system come down on them like a ton of bricks. In this case, the anvil feel on Mike Nifong like in a Road Runner cartoon. Nifong is also facing criminal charges as well, so it might actually go to jail for his actions. If that isn’t poetic justice, then I don’t know what is.
For me abuse of power has always been the thing — right below privilege — that always bugs me, and that’s the part of this case that attracted my interest.
That’s the thing about Nifong: his hijinks in this case had something to offend everybody, if they were paying attention.
There are many other cases where prosecutors have crossed the line, but many of the same people who showed outrage over Nifong, say nothing when those other cases arise.
If I were Reade Seligmann, Collin Finnerty, and Dave Evans, I’d sue Duke University, the Durham Police Department, and Mike Nifong.
Nifong is the only one who MAY be able to be sued. The police are generally exempt from lawsuits as are prosecutors.
Frankly, I don’t see what the students can sue Duke University for. Even the profs who backed the liar could be off of the hook because they could say they believed Nifong’s comments.
Let’s be real: how many people who were outraged by Nifong, are outraged by the cases The Innocence Project brings to light?
He was appointed to the job, so the election was his first – he was not seeking re-election.
Although I’m aware of that fact, I used the word “reelection” out of habit. I’ll make the correction. – Admin
Your comments about Nifong are on target.
I hope, though, that the students involved in this learn a lesson: If they had not been present under very sordid circumstances they could not have been targets for slander and these particular false accusations.
DarkStar:
Most of us, sweetheart, are outraged at injustice wherever it occurs.
But it is indeed possible to sue for false prosecution. It depends on the circumstances, so don’t simply assume it’s not possible in this case.
Trish, I wrote “generally”.
Most of us, sweetheart, are outraged at injustice wherever it occurs.
I don’t see it coming from all, only from some.
Didja HEAR the guy? Doncha love how he kept saying, over and over, “To the extent that I….” ? He couldn’t bring himself to say, “I lied, deceived, pandered, and I am very sorry…” But always, “To the extent that I did these things, I apologize.” In other words, if the extent wasn’t that far, then I apologize just a little. The whole statement was so Clintonesque I wanted to gag!
DarkStar;
Trying to hold everyone responsible for things that they did not know is so typical of you and so unfair.
Let’s have a comparable situation in which black lacrosse players are obviously innocent (by the same DNA procedures that is used to prove innocence in the Innocnence Project), but accused of raping a white stripper and the whole nation gets behind the obviously lying stripper.
Everyone knows about this because it is in the news. Now, lets have the KKK invade the campus and make the innocent afraid to live in their own homes. Top that off with a bunch of faculty members who bash and bash and bash the black lacrosee players coupled with a campus full of students whose infammatory rhetoric is akin to what one would expect from a lynch mob.
Now, let’s have a whole city vote for a racist prosecutor simply because he is sticking it to a group of black men.
And, let’s finish it off with the black families going into debt for the rest of their lives to defend their obviously innocent children.
Then, let’s talk.
Darkstar–
Okay, but understand that when you say “generally” it’s GENERALLY assumed to mean “most, if not all.”
Isn’t this whole brouhaha about stereotypes in the first place?
I have a question.
When a lawyer is disbarred, does that mean he cannot practice anywhere in the U.S. or does it pertain only to the state in which they are presently practicing?
Hey, all is not lost. Nifong can still run for office on the Democrat ticket in Durham. Maybe he had his sights set on higher positions and just wanted to enhance his reputation among the Durham voters. Wiley, that one.
Well, this story is NOT over. Mikey has more fun coming. As Rae Evans said, “He’s going to regret this the rest of his life”.
I honestly believe he will serve time, probably for Federal Civil Rights violations conviction. Maybe next month for state criminal contempt conviction.
It is pile on time and everyone is lining up.
It could not happen to a better A**hole.
Lashawn you need to understand how much your support has helped all the Duke families.
Thanks,
Kemp
Oh, boo hoo. I couldn’t believe it when I read that Nifong shed tears . . . for himself, of course.
I DO wish that the students could sue Duke University. Those of you who say it can’t be done, don’t be so pessimistic. I’m sure there is a way, and I’m sure that the boys’ attorneys will find it. I hope they do. These professors who decided to abandon the “innocent until proven guilty” tenet of our legal system need to pay the price.
DarkStar, I just have one thing to say to you: you are SO predictable.
If I were Travis County DA Ronnie Earle or Special Prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald, I would at least think about hiring my own lawyer after Nifong’s meltdown. Dishonest rogue prosecutors can be punished it seems.
As a Christian, one of the hardest things about my faith is that I am called to forgive people like Mike Nifong.
Hopefully, this is just the first in a series of hearings/trials that will bring about justice.
I don’t buy his crocodile tears, but never the less I somehow am supposed to forgive him. Seeing justice starting to be delivered is helping.
I hope no one feels the slightest bit sorry for Nifong. He earned this. He worked diligently and with great gusto to arrive at the degree of malfeasance that gets people disbarred.
I do not feel sorry for Nifong. But the entire NC State Bar assoc should be ashamed of themselves and anyone on that board should turn in their license to practice law along side Nifong. They did the right thing in disbarring Nifong, but what has been the stance on Darryl Hunt? Oh yea just let the state taxpayers give a million plus dollar payout for those rogue prosecutors. I love selective outrage.
Trying to hold everyone responsible for things that they did not know is so typical of you and so unfair.
I never wrote that I’m holding everyone responsible for things they did not know. However, many of the public commentators on the Duke mess, know about The Innocence Project and their work. Shaun Hannity? Knows about them. Rush Limbaugh? Knows about them. Bill O’Reily? Knows about them. George Will? Knows about them. Thomas Sowell? Knows about them.
Let’s have a comparable situation in which black lacrosse players are obviously innocent (by the same DNA procedures that is used to prove innocence in the Innocnence Project), but accused of raping a white stripper and the whole nation gets behind the obviously lying stripper.
Tulia, Texas.
Isn’t this whole brouhaha about stereotypes in the first place?
What is stereotyping by saying in general, police and prosecutors are exempt from being sued because of their actions during their line of duty?
I honestly believe he will serve time, probably for Federal Civil Rights violations conviction.
Hopefully, he will.
These professors who decided to abandon the “innocent until proven guilty†tenet of our legal system need to pay the price.
For the profs, and everyone else, this is a concept, not something they can be brought to court for.
DarkStar, I just have one thing to say to you: you are SO predictable.
I hate to disappoint, but hey, PROVE ME WRONG.
I forgot about this one by George Will.
Strike that name.
Lynn-
Disbarrment will keep him from practicing law in North Carolina, where he was licensed to practice. It is my understanding that in five years he may petition to have his license reinstated. And, if seven years passes without his reinstatement, he would have to begin again (taking the bar exam, etc.). He can petition other states to allow him to have a license to practice (it varies amongst states as to what hoops you have to jump through to do this), but I wouldn’t imagine anyone would be jumping at a chance to have him in their state.
Melinda,
Thanks for your response. I truly appreciate the explanation.
Has anyone looked up the case that was against the University of Colorado football program? Very similar but selective outrage is way to popular, we all need to be a victim. I suggest you people go to http://www.ncaa.org and look up the term “lack of institutional control” then review all the facts in the Duke Lacrosse case.
… maybe Mike and Crystal Gail ought to consider getting married … ‘ya might as well consummate the screw-job Ms. Mangum pulled on ‘ol Mike, and that he was dumb enough to fall for it.
Nifong’s case is significant in several ways.
Here was a clear case where a District Attorney acted in his own self interest at the expense of innocent people.
Who appointed Nifong the judge and jury to decide to falsely accuse three innocent young men to further his own career?
Trying to win a case… the competitive blood, that may be wrong. But at least you can argue that you did it to protect citizens at large.
But to try and frame innocent (yes, I-N-N-O-C-E-N-T) men, so as to put $15,000 more per year in your own pension pocket? How low can a human being possibly sink?
Then to inflame racial tensions, again, just to improve your political standings? Again how low can a human being possibly sink?
Thomas Macaulay once said, “The measure of a mans real character is what he would do if he knew he would never be found out”. Chairman of the Disciplinary Hearings Commission Lane Williamson reminded all of us that we may each come to a point where our morals were challenged. And he suggested that many of us might fail such a test.
But I would suggest to you that most of us would not sell others’ souls for the sake of our own well-being.
And that, today, is the difference in Mike Nifong and you and I.
And that is why such a harsh penalty was justified.
RebelPOW how does this differ from Darryl Hunt in the same state of North Carolina?
Mike Nifong had every reason to believe that playing the race card would work. It immediately brought out the Jackson and Sharpton rent-a-mobs. It motivated the President of Duke and the faculty “88″ to go into overdrive as they assumed the politically correct position of righteousness indignation toward the rich, white dilettante accused. The mainstream media went along with his program at a full gallop.
The malcontents and civics deficient in Durham voted Nifong into office, even as major cracks in the case became evident. Strong evidence that his plan worked.
Nifong came within an ace of pulling it off.
The Permanent Nobody Knows The Trouble I’ve Seen Black lobbyists and minions have got the liberals so cowed and most of the rest so hesitant to speak up that the race card almost always works.
What group of people in the United States riots and burns parts of cities when they get stirred up? (Hint: Their “spokesmen” are named Jackson, Sharpton.) Who says they are the spokesmen? (Who else does the mainstream media put on the air?)
Nothing about Nifong is redeeming. But he had every right to expect to get away with his stunt.
The country is full of people who earnestly believe that the justice system is rigged against them. They don’t care whether O.J. is a murderer or not. They admire him for having beat a system that is, in their minds, rigged against black people.
The real problems for us all in this affair (beyond Nifong) are those liberals and those stuck in race overdrive who can not stand back and be patient and objective.
As an aside, I believe the legislature of North Carolina should pass “private bills” for each of the players that pays their legal expenses and awards each of them a significant cash settlement. It would save the states a lot of money and headaches and it would allow the students to put this behind them and move on.
Mike Nifong should face federal charges on civil rights violations.
The president of Duke and the faculty “88″ should consider hiring Nifong as a resident ethics advisor.
You did a fine job keeping with this crap here Lashawn, as I kept watching it myself on my home and here as well.
My question for all now is when is it gonna be the accusers turn in the spotlight to be wrecked and ruined for life? No ramifications of causing this swath of destruction she incurred, even to the now sad sack seeming idiot Nifong who’s gullibility only rivals his blind ambition?
Not if I were king.
Check out the book “Its Not About the Truth” By Don Yaeger and Coach Mike Pressler and to see what Colin, David, Reade and the Duke Lax family went through is enough to get anyones blood boiling.
The sad part is that this could have happened to any guy in America, and for them the Duke case is public example of what happens when the truth doesn’t matter.
One could hope that the names on “The Grail” will have civil suits attached to them in the future. (Read the book to understand this!)
As far as civil suits are concerned, starting with Nifong is one thing-I would add President Broadhead, Joe Alleva, various members of the “Group of 88″ who said the most vilest of things, The New Black Panther Party/Rainbow Push, R-D Police Department-especially Gottieb, and Himan and finally Crystal Gail Mangum.
BTW-Did anyone hear of the recent alleged Duke rape where the alleged suspect is black from a historically black fraternity and the alleged victim is a white Duke female? The silence from the Group of 88 and the media is deafening.
The players can sue a large number of people/organizations. Governmental entities can be sued for civil rights violations, under federal law. The private players in this, including the professors, people in the media, and certain newspapers can be sued for slander and libel.
Count me as one who is definitely more concerned about prosecutorial misconduct that I know about, as opposed to that which I don’t know about. [insert rolling eyes here]
I suppose I could make a quest out of the issue, and research news archives gathering data about all the other cases, but then that’s hardly the point here. This thread is about one case, and about the peculiarities and social issues unique to it, making it rather logical that the responses might be about this one case.
What group of people in the United States riots and burns parts of cities when they get stirred up? (Hint: Their “spokesmen†are named Jackson, Sharpton.) Who says they are the spokesmen? (Who else does the mainstream media put on the air?)
White kids at Penn when the police shut down their beer party? White kids at Univ. of MD when they lose a basketball game to Duke? White kids at Univ. of MD when they win the NCAA championship in basketball? (Causing COMCAST to redo the fiber network they just did to the tune of $200Million). White kids at Minn. U (?) when the police shut down their beer party?
Count me as one who is definitely more concerned about prosecutorial misconduct that I know about, as opposed to that which I don’t know about. [insert rolling eyes here]
Keep rolling your eyes. Your willful ignorance keeps the status quo, but then when groups like The Innocence Project does its work and gets someone else off, and there are newspaper articles about it, all you will continue to do is keep your head in the sand.
Again I wonder why no one else seems to have mentioned that N.C. needs to review all cases in which Nifong was involved.
I suppose I could make a quest out of the issue, and research news archives gathering data about all the other cases, but then that’s hardly the point here.
I suppose you could but you most likely never will because “we all know if you are charged, chances are you did it.” Until, that is, someone you know comes under the glare.
Just ask Rush Limbaugh who now questions the powers of district attorneys.
Wow. You drew those erroneous conclusions from what I posted, while missing my primary point entirely? Amazing. [insert more rolling eyes]
Who says they are the spokesmen? (Who else does the mainstream media put on the air?)
In other words, white folks made them spokesmen.
If a minortity doesn’t speak up for the outrageous behavior of jackson, et al-then don’t blame other ethnic groups or conservative minorities when they do as mere race baiting.
Darkstar is making way too much sense here.
If there is one issue that needs to be made a “quest” here, it’s the stuff of which DarkStar speaks. It makes no sense to ignore injustice until it’s your ox getting gored, because by then it is often too later.
Er, “too late.”
Dark;
Im not sure you know what subject we are talking about on this thread. It is the DUKE LACROSSE HOAX. Not the innocence project. Not Hurricaine Carter or any other cherry-picked cases. It is ridiculous to accuse people of not talking about case “B” on a website thread dedicated to case “A”. Im sure you could go to a site dedicated to atrocities in East Timor and chastize them for not talking about Darfur..heck, you could even call them racists (go figure). Go to a site dedicated to cancer research and call them homophobes for not talking about AIDS.
To enlighten you, many have indeed put forth the notion of reviewing ALL cases Nifong has prosecuted. The “they were charged so they did it” crowd was in full battle mode about a year ago…seems they are kind of quiet now. I bet they hang out mostly at the Nancy Grace website (cant tell you where it is because I dont care).
You seem to want so badly for whites to act in a stereotype that exists in your mind (and in the minds of a few activist-type) and seem frustrated when we dont…..sorry pal.
I understand the truth hurts. LaShawn does a good job of framing it in a reasonable non-confrontational manner. I’m not that tactful.
Talking as a white guy…the AA community as a whole has BIG BIG problems. Ignoring them or minimalizing them or even blaming them on whitey isnt going to help. But hey, Im just a white guy
My brother is a member of both the NY and CT bar, and a former assistant D.A. in Queens. The suspension period varies from state to state, but I think Nifong can re-apply. Interestingly, Bill Clinton was disbarred after his impeachment in the state of Arkansas, but can reapply; but he can never try a case in the U.S. Supreme Court.
I have an idea to ensure that people like Jesse and Al don’t get labeled by whitey as black folks’ spokesmen: why don’t black folks quit giving money to PUSH, Ebony Mag, Essence, Jet, BET? Why don’t you form new organizations, write the papers and TV stations, hold demonstrations, and bring new candidates to the ring? Maybe then all of us won’t have to hear their mess anymore.
Under NC bar rules, in five years, Nifong can reapply to get his license back.
You, know, I wouldn’t feel too sorry for the guy. The talk shows, book and movie deals and lecture circuits are only a heartbeat away. He will come out alright. He will be raking in it.
If I were a betting woman, I’d wager $1,000 that Nifong was contacted by book publishers offering fat advances right after the NC bar filed charges against him, if not before.
#38 Shade: Bingo!!! (Mostly.)
The liberal white main stream media made them spokesmen. The “black community” just sat back and let them strut and bluster and run for president. Only occasionally and on FOX do I ever see a black stand up to their race baiting and poverty pimping. Why is that?
#36 DarkStar: Did you forget the Aggies when the bonfire was banned? I still think Reginald Denny got a raw deal for being white during a black riot. When those idiot, drunk, sports addicted college students (all presumably white, rich and pampered) start burning and looting whole sections of cities, I will concede your point. Until then, I think the comparison is something less than lame.
#14 — A lawyer may only practice in the jurisdictions where they are barred, usually by state. Some jurisdictions allow you to practice when barred in another jurisdiction only if you are in good standing. No doubt Nifong will be prohibited from practicing everywhere, as it is doubtful another jurisdiction will “bar” him when North Carolina disbarred him.
Maybe Bill Clinton could play the Nifong role in the movie.
I enjoy reading LaShawn’s blog because of the conservative, Christian perspective. Generally, I disagree with everything from the liberal, victimhood, anti-Christian left. What I find very troubling is the tendency to attribute human characteristics purely on a basis of race. While there is a privileged class in this country that predominately consists of WASPs, this is a very small minority of the total white population. It is just as wrong to assume that every white boy (or girl) in this country comes from this privileged background as is to apply a stereotype to all members of the black community. Nothing justifies either stereotype.
Isn’t it about time EVERYONE made efforts to rid ourselves of these misconceptions and prejudices. Both are unfair and incorrect.
Changed Life – good point about race and privilege. If I had a dime for every time I’ve heard that the lacrosse players’ families were “wealthy,” or “could afford” these legal fees, I’d be rich myself.
Folks, most upper middle class families do NOT have a million dollars laying around. I would not be surprised to find that these families had to take out second or third mortgages on homes, or had to cash in on retirement accounts. There’s the Paris Hilton/Bill Gates/Hollywood kind of wealth, and then there’s upper middle class wealth. The two are very, very different.
“Isn’t it about time EVERYONE made efforts to rid ourselves of these misconceptions and prejudices. Both are unfair and incorrect.”
I think you’ll be in for a fight making those kind of statements. There are many here who will defend ‘generalizing’ and ’stereotyping’ as it is, I quote:
“generally true”
Only those PC liberals ignore the black elephant in the room etc.
What’s that noise? Oh, I believe it’s the sound of various and sundry axes being ground.
I think you’ll be in for a fight making those kind of statements. There are many here who will defend ‘generalizing’ and ’stereotyping’ as it is, I quote:
“generally trueâ€
Didn’t LaShawn write that sterotypes are generally true?
The liberal white main stream media made them spokesmen. The “black community†just sat back and let them strut and bluster and run for president. Only occasionally and on FOX do I ever see a black stand up to their race baiting and poverty pimping. Why is that?
The “black community” doesn’t let them do anything. They are free men who can do as they please. Only occasionally and on FOX do I ever see a white stand up to ‘feminazis’, ‘radical gay activists’, and ‘environmental whackos’. Why is that? See how silly your premise is?
If Sharpon or Jackson disappeared off of the face of the Earth, absolutely nothing would change with regards to black people. How about convincing your white brethren to get their attention off of them instead of whining about how black people don’t respond in the way that you like.
#36 DarkStar: Did you forget the Aggies when the bonfire was banned? I still think Reginald Denny got a raw deal for being white during a black riot. When those idiot, drunk, sports addicted college students (all presumably white, rich and pampered) start burning and looting whole sections of cities, I will concede your point. Until then, I think the comparison is something less than lame.
The Tulsa Race Riot is the worst in American history. Guess who committed it? Rosewood was a massacre.
And before you cite timespans, the LA riot was 15 years ago and the one before that was over 40 years ago, both in the same city. Any others didn’t cover ‘whole sections of cities’.
And I don’t recall any drunken riots at any HBCUs, but I may be wrong.
Kim,
My point is that not every white family is uppper middle class. I come from a poor working class white family that became much poorer when my parents divorced and my mother attempted to finish raising four teenager & pre-teen children by working three jobs. There was no “privilege” white or otherwise in my upbringing.
Also, there is a big difference between the wealth of Paris Hilton and Bill Gates. The entire Hilton family is worth maybe $600 million, Paris’ share of that puts her estimated net worth at $30 million. Now $600 is a lot of dough, as is $30 million is also a lot of money.
But if their net worth earned even 5% interest a year, Gates earns in less than 6 hours what Paris earns in a year yet while Paris could earn in one month what less than 10% of the US population earns in a year.
Upper middle class is defined as less than 17% of households and less than 5% of individuals earn over $100,000, income being one of the characteristics of upper middle class. Values, professions, and education are other factors define the upper middle class. However, the vast majority of white people do not even come close to being upper middle class in income.
It is obvious that these boys where railroaded, and the conclusion to this affair is just. What concerns me is the fury directed at the black community. I am aware that there are characters who protested and made noise intially over the mess this woman started, but from what I can tell the black community was cautious in judgement over this case. I know the new black panthers showed up to make their voices heard, however what else do you expect such a group to do. Much like Sharpton and Jackson these characters simply seek attention.
The larger issue it seems is the justice system being driven by characters seeking personal gain, and by popular opinion. Frankly if these boys at a fine institution such as Duke can be screwed in such away I wonder what happens to lesser people.
In my opinion this case was driven by those outside the black community, ie, nifong, press, professors. I think those who still think that blanks move in lockstop everytime sharpton or jackson says something are wholly misinformed.
If anything blacks are and should be cautious when anytime charges are levelled against anyone.
Duke paid up.
You raise good points, Brandon. Many black folk are quite familiar with overzealous police and prosecutors. Why does something like this obvious miscarriage of justice have to come into the mainstream for white folks to take notice?? This happens all day everyday to folks of lesser means or notoriety, regardless of color.
Taking a bigger look at this whole situation my thoughts are that young college men and women need to be careful about placing themselves in situations that have to potential to become extremely volatile. Better judgement should be exercised.
University administrators need to make a concerned effort to better manage ‘town-gown’ relations. Students are only there for 4 or 5 years while residents are there sometimes for life and it seems that Duke did not do the best job of impressing upon students the need to co-exist with permanent residents while still allowing the students to enjoy the collegiate experience.
I think we all (myself included) have learned a lot about jumping to conclusions without getting the full story.
This happens all day everyday to folks of lesser means or notoriety, regardless of color.
Many people who are part of the justice system believe this is true.
I’m a black female and most other blacks I know didn’t care about any facts in this case. They simply wanted an instance of racism that they could use to justify their continued stance of victimhood. Once that dissolved, so did their interest. It’s nothing complicated about it.
It’s a very sad thing to witness.
I’m black and male and most blacks I know cared about the facts and were mad when the truth became known because it would mean other cases where something did happen, would not be taken seriously.
I’m also a black male and most blacks I know cared about the facts and were mad when the truth became known because it would mean other cases where something did happen, would not be taken seriously.
To Brandon and Jerome.
Ditto.
I know some poster’s have said that Crystal Gail Mangum should get hers too… Well, I predict in time she will, by her own doing, just like Nifong.
I predict she’ll eventually be convicted of one or more of the following: prostitution, assault, assault with a deadly weapon (by motor vehicle), drunk and disorderly, theft, filing false charges against another innocent person, giving someone AIDS when she knew she tested positive, etc. You name it. It will happen, folks. Mark my words…
jan b, those “in the community” who voted for Nifong for the wrong reason were racist. Some may actually think about “What was I thinking” and re-examine their racist attitudes and actions. Others will not. This entire case could be the turning point for those who insist on discovering The Truth and insisting on that alone.
Thanks, La Shawn, for posting a Duke/Nifong story where we can all post responses. It’s good to see RedBeard, RebelPOW, Heliotrope, Tiffany, Shade, Belle, Kempx, KIm, Tate, and yes, even DarkStar, engaged once again in discourse on your board. Not that I agree with all of ‘em, but by and large, they’re all good — we’ve seen some challenging comments, humorous comments and some beat-downs when comments deserve to be beat down.
All in a days bloggin’, I reckon. Thanks for the chance.
TaterCon
PS: Where’s SteveDinMD?
I keep hearing posters say that “most blacks I know”…
Meanwhile, many of us saw a seemingly unelectable man elected because he was hanging privileged white kids out to dry.
A LOT of someones did NOT care about the facts.
A lot of someones on Mangum’s campus as well as on the liberal Duke campus did NOT care about the facts.
As far as being mad when the truth became irrefutable — color me unimpressed.
http://www.newsobserver.com/news/crime_safety/duke_lacrosse/nifong/story/608629.html
N&O says Judge Orlando Hudson is suspending Nifong as DA, effective tomorrow, and is appointing a special prosecutor. Details in the link … if I’ve figured out how to punch the keyboard buttons and mouse-click thing correctly.
(Hey, I’m still tech challenged in a lot of ways — when I started practicing law, IBM mag cards were in every office, but the hi-tech firms were spending the big bucks for dedicated word processors — like the IBM Display Writer!!)
TaterCon
Hey Tater! Good to hear from you! In case you didn’t know, you and Jan are my hero’s…
But of course, I consider La Shawn to be the bestest hero of all time…
color me unimpressed
More like uninformed.
Shade;
Why don’t you just inform me……….
Tate;
High five and howdy with a smile AND you are right that LaShawn is the bestest!
Chief RZ (re: 68);
Great point and this case should be a lesson to all. Seldom has the country had access to a scenario of injustice playing out so vividly on a daily basis. Much of this has to do with the advent of the internet and its growing presence as a source of news and information.
I had nine guys in my Offender Aid and Restoration session tonight at the local lock-up. Three of them took off on how Nifong was just the tip of the iceberg of a vastly racist and corrupt justice system. The other six voted them out of the session.
When I talked with them about their decision to shut the three guys out, their answers were quite telling. It boiled down to “how can you expect to be restored to the community when you ‘play games’ about why you are in here?”
TaterCon #71 says…
“N&O says Judge Orlando Hudson is suspending Nifong as DA, effective tomorrow, and is appointing a special prosecutor. Details in the link … if I’ve figured out how to punch the keyboard buttons and mouse-click thing correctly.”
Isn’t it interesting once it’s safe to come out of the bombproof (”Reminiscences of the Civil War” by John B Gordon, TaterCon) all the rats agree that they were there with you all along?
Hudson was a coward before the hearing, and as early as this morning was still trying to protect Nifong. Suddenly he’s seen Jesus. Amazing, isn’t it?
John Harland, I have little time but this one is for you are your assumptions:
Im not sure you know what subject we are talking about on this thread. It is the DUKE LACROSSE HOAX.
Others on this board tend to expand the subject at hand on a regular basis. See the post about rioting for details.
To enlighten you, many have indeed put forth the notion of reviewing ALL cases Nifong has prosecuted.
In my area, improper conduct by police and/or prosecutors has immediately produced the prosecutors openly stating they are reviewing all cases where the offending parties have been involved. Please point me to something similar.
You seem to want so badly for whites to act in a stereotype that exists in your mind (and in the minds of a few activist-type) and seem frustrated when we dont…..sorry pal.
You make an assumption that I assume whites to act in a certain way, when that is not the case. I would not expect Rush Limbaugh and Tim Wise to react in the same way to certain things. And, I find it interesting that you and heliotrope brought race into my comments when I never mentioned race EXCEPT in response. And I’M the one with a problem?
Did you forget the Aggies when the bonfire was banned?
No. But that was a University sponsored event that went wrong, IIRC.
I still think Reginald Denny got a raw deal for being white during a black riot.
So do I as well as the Black man who saved him. OH, police reports and charges filed indicate it was more of a Hispanic event.
When those idiot, drunk, sports addicted college students (all presumably white, rich and pampered) start burning and looting whole sections of cities, I will concede your point. Until then, I think the comparison is something less than lame.
UCLA students rioted after a bowl win. They turned over cars, including a police car, and torched them. Their riot was about 4 square blocks. Then there was the riot after NE won a Super Bowl. The riots in State College, PA, caused some nice damage as well. But State College is pretty much the school itself, but that was from my memory of a visit about 20 years ago. I’ll add the Boston riots over busing.
Why don’t you form new organizations, write the papers and TV stations, hold demonstrations, and bring new candidates to the ring? Maybe then all of us won’t have to hear their mess anymore
Why is your ignorance, Blacks’ problem?
My point is that not every white family is uppper middle class.
Guess who didn’t make that assumption? DS raises hand…
Well, I predict in time she will, by her own doing, just like Nifong.
I feel sorry for her children. The DA said they weren’t going to charge her because of her mental state. Unfortunately, having someone in my family with a condition that impacts her children, I really understand what that can do to the children.
A LOT of someones did NOT care about the facts.
Here’s a mirror.
Nifong decides that he will resign on July 13? Hello? Hello? Hello?
What is that all about? Does he need quality time with a shredder or something?
And by the way, aren’t there more than a few people in Nifong’s office who have to been in on this farce with him? Didn’t they also take one of those sacred oaths?
DarkStar;
Hopefully, you are looking in the mirror.
#42 john harland:
You are being “beaten about the head and shoulders with a great stick” by DarkStar in #80.
A great deal of the heated response is aimed at comments which I made.
Please accept my sincere willingness to take the brunt of the assault.
#79 RebelPOW:
Thanks for the “head’s up” on Judge Orlando Hudson! I found an interesting commentary on him at: http://www.renewamerica.us/columns/gaynor/070208
heliotrope is correct, I joined posts when I should have broken them up. Sorry about joining those, but my comments about who made the assumptions stands and stands strong.
it looks like Judge Hudson is doing the right thing by suspending Mr Nifong until the governor can kick him out
I am confused about one thing. Aren’t the group of 88 Duke professors and other sundry Duke employees who signed their own statement about the students liable to be sued for defamation of character or slander? What protects them from a civil suit?
Helio (re #78);
You brought up a point of great importance and I would like to hear your point expanded. On virtually every website that has focused upon the Duke case (or even the Hilton case), there is the oft repeated refrain that black/poor men are routinely treated with injustice in the justice system.
After a significant number of interviews with police, prosecuting and defending attorneys, and criminal justice experts, what has emerged is a picture of defendants who may not have “perfect process” but are also guilty. From every conversation, the picture actually emerges of criminals plea’ing out for lack of “compelling” corroborating evidence (no one would snitch or the benefits of pursual were not commensurate with the likely outcome). The picture emerges of individuals who are thrown in jail for a “minor” offense but only while having rap sheets the size of novels/novellas.
Yet, the notion persists that untold innocent individuals are thrown in jail and accused of crimes they did not commit.
What are your thoughts on this? Studies?
#89 What are your thoughts on this? Studies?
I don’t know about studies on this subject, just personal observation. I live in CT. Almost every morning on the news there is a story about another shooting or stabbing in Hartford, New Haven or Bridgeport. 80-90% of those crimes are committed on and by black people. I don’t know if that is all the crime committed in CT every day, but that’s what we hear about. I live is a smaller city where I have friends on the police force, the majority of thier time is spent answering calls in the projects. The impression that I get is that the jails hold a larger percentage of the black population because a larger percentage of the black population is committing crimes.
You know what blows my mind? This guy had a LICENSE. I mean, I have been struggling to get my license for ages now, and if I got it I’d work so hard to keep it and not endanger it. And this guy just, blew it big time. After a good long career in the prosecutor’s office as well. I’m pretty baffled by the whole thing. What was this guy thinking?
#89 Jan: Sorry to be so tardy.
I have done court watches on judges, defense lawyers and Commonwealth’s Attorneys who are accused of bias or incompetence. Sometimes, those watched are the ones who have asked to be watched.
I have seen my share of accused get “shuffled through the system.” But, unfortunately for them, they were so patently guilty that it was a favor to the taxpayer.
In Offender Aid and Restoration we have to “triage” the prisoners, because those who will not help themselves are a drag on a valuable resource.
I spent two weeks recently at the state police academy and our work revolved around officers, black, white and Hispanic being personally maligned and falsely accused within certain communities. Every narcotics officer reported having a reputation for stealing and selling drugs having affairs at the point of a gun.
All this is to say that the urban myths about the justice system are firmly rooted and deeply held by those who choose to believe them.
Unfortunately, cops, lawyers, judges, and Commonwealth’s Attorneys do just enough stupid stuff that they stoke the fires. We just had a cop/teenager interracial oral sex incident that will go down as living proof for generations.
And there are some rotten apples that turn up, as well.
I always approach things from the perspective that people do not set out to fail. Occasionally, I find people who are candidates for “retroactive abortion.” But mostly, I find people believe in their work and sometimes make a mistake.
Specifically, in our community, the urban legends are hogwash. In a neighboring county, we have a sheriff who is a real Wyatt Earp. But his instincts are fantastic and most of his problems come from arresting his own inbred cousins. But he is Hell on wheels.
I suspect you research and my experience coincide: A lot of rumors and whining and very little evidence and even less proof.
This is just a follow-up to the N&O story posted and linked last night, saying Judge Hudson was going to suspend Nifong from office, and was appointing a “special prosecutor”… Looking more closely at the order (a .pdf is available on the N&O website), we’re not seeing a special prosecutor with the power to investigate and bring criminal charges in the classic sense of a federal special prosecutor. He’s only appointing Mr. Zaytoun to be the prosecutor in the special proceeding initiated by Beth Brewer to remove Nifong, and to report back to Judge Hudson, ready for a hearing, in 30 days.
Hello? Hello? Didn’t Nifongo say “Color me gone on the 13th of July”? Twenty four days from now? And wasn’t Nifongo suspended “with pay”, pending the hearing? If he’s gone on his own terms in 24 days, isn’t a hearing after 30 days rendered moot?
Seems to me the Hudson order is more symbolic than substantive. Seems to me it gives a disgraced public official a paid vacation to head down to the beach….
TaterCon
Helio;
Thank you for the utterly thoughtful reply and yes, your response affirms what I have seen, though my perspective is always greatly enhanced by input from folks that I greatly admire for the force of their intellect.
I have done significant research on the criminal justice system despite apparently emerging “uniformed”-(smiles).
I hardly know where to start dismantling the urban myths in the US.
Living in the Middle East, it became very apparent how selectively introducing “facts” gives birth to a smoldering anger that serves no one.
On a trivial note, I remember once reading a post about “driving while black.” After reading the 321 hear-my-shocking-story responses, I was stunned that any of the posters thought that their situation was unique in any way and it hit me that most had no clue about what it is like to grow up “white.” Ergo, many bask in the luxury of being able to attribute “human life with all of its warts/travails” to being black.
Oh well…
Jan, as an echo to your last comment:
Psychiatrists often counsel people that their view of reality is actually a series of “snap shots” in their mental album of their life experiences.
I think this true, but only if you let your view of reality blind you to what you can observe around you if you are willing to keep an open mind.
I have found “victims” to be pretty closed minded and too ready to wallow in their own sad world. I call them Eeyores….as in Winnie the Pooh.
Since psychiatrists mostly deal with “victims”, I suppose that is why they came up with the limited (in my opinion) definition of reality.
Helio;
How does one go about dismantling entrenched mythology? I tend to think that success is the preferred way, but this dynamic is difficult when folks refuse to grab a toe-hold on life and are provided with crutches to enable their refusal.
I am far from from a ‘victim’ but I am also far from naive either. I swear sometimes I think some of you must be living in some fantasy world or are just plain old clueless.
And as an educated black woman, I do consider myself a successful productive citizen.
Obstacles that many minority groups and poor whites come up against are not ‘mythology’.
Sometimes I wonder why I bother to respond.
Tiffany, there’s quite a wide gulf between you as a productive citizen facing obstacles (admirable) and those who consider themselves permanent victims (pathetic). No comparison, actually.
Are we still on for coffee?
I should have worded that: “as a productive citizen facing and overcoming obstacles.”
#96 jan,
I guess it is a generational thing. I see people in bad neighborhoods finally break through and get out of the place. I see others who move out but take the “hood” with them.
I am a dedicated vounteer out of Christian brotherhood. I do not like social engineering. I believe that public housing and urban renewal set our progress back for probably two generations.
I have seen community policing work well and I have seen it fail. I think this is because there is no simple dynamic at hand to deal with constantly ebbing and flowing social pathologies.
Finally, I have encountered too many people who would rather suffer than consider the possibility of lessening the weight of the chip on their shoulders. Everyday I walk into encounters where my skin color is the first issue. I’m just wearing my God-given equipment. But for too many, they can read my mind, my heart and my intentions by my pigment. Add a police uniform to that, and what do you get?
#96
Good posts by Heliotrope…Innocence Project notwithstanding, there are very few cases of actual innocence and a lot of cases of prosecutors probably preserving the public safety by removing criminals from the streets whatever way they can.
How to dismantle entrenched mythology? My local news had a story today. A big picture of fresh-faced, adorable pre-school children, obviously celebrating. Then…you read the story: an all-black pre-school celebrated Juneteenth, complete with quotes from earnest teachers about the importance of teaching these little ones about slavery and where their ancestors came from and what they suffered. Professional victim school.
There is a difference between teaching facts and inculcating a viewpoint destined to create an identity inseperable from one’s race.
What is wrong with teaching children about the significance of Juneteenth, and what is wrong with teaching black children (and all children really) about the history of black people and about slavery? Why is that “victim school”? Is teaching Jewish children about the Holocaust therefore also “victim school”? And if you think the two are different at all explain why?
Isn’t it important that children learn history – not so that they can use it as an excuse but so that they are not doomed to repeat or propagate it?
#102
Who suggested there is anything wrong in learning about Juneteenth? But is there any other race or culture that begins teaching its children at a young age about something that serves no purpose at that point other than to create a spirit of resentment and differentiation? Why on earth would you do that to a five-year old? I am not Jewish, so I do not know if it is standard to teach Jewish five year olds about the Holocaust before they learn anything else about being Jewish, but it seems unlikely.
Do our schools routinely focus all students on the dark periods of history that apply to their ethnic group as a way of solidifying a group identity?
What would be wrong with starting the little ones with a basic “we are all Americans” approach. Given our multicultural nation, maybe stories about famous Americans of various times and of various ethnicities. Then (5th grade?), a tour of world history – in which the subject of slavery would first be broached.
The next year or two, American history, warts and all. Is that hiding something? Or is it simply giving a fighting chance for the primary identification to be American, rather than black whose great-great-great….grandparents might have been enslaved, but who has no personal experience of such? This is a pipe dream. The political value of an entrenched victim mentality is too high.
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