And what and why would you consider my sentiments to be a “pout”?

It’s quite interesting, though not surprising, how you all can characterize the statements of others, while not owning up to the lack of virtues of those of your ideology and persuasion.

If you have NEVER met or heard those statements, then good for you, sir. That’s a good thing, don’t you agree?

And there you go with that ALL statement again.

A war of attrition, indeed.. wow.

I have no difficulty comprehending anything, I just think that unfortunately you think you’re virtuous regarding these matters, when you are not.

When you say that someone is quite exceptional in a group, that – by extrapolation – means that virtually all of the rest of the group is different. See the original statement I made below for clarification.

The inferences that you draw about people from very little evidence are bizarre.

Lastly, after reading your very long pout, I stand by my opinion that you need to seek help. You are obviously angry and have a great deal of difficulty determining what is actually said, if your responses are any indication.

I also stand by my very concrete statement that I have never met a Christian who believes that simply being liberal -IN AND OF ITSELF – disqualifies one for salvation.

Comment by Jan: “However, in the interest of honesty, YOU stated that virtually ALL Christians claimed that ANY liberal was not saved by simple virtue of the fact that they were liberal.”

The exchange, for your edification:

Trish wrote:

“OOOh, I’m a big, bad conservative Christian, so I guess I’m supposed to think liberals aren’t saved because they’re liberals. I bet you have read that a thousand times. Heard it, too. I’m sure plenty of people believe it.

The only trouble is, it’s completely untrue.
Conservative Christians do NOT believe that liberals are not saved because of their political stance (unlike liberals, who unanimously believe all conservatives are damned, even when the liberals are atheists).”

And I wrote:

“If you don’t believe that Trish then you are obviously exceptional.”

And I MEANT exactly what I wrote. You don’t like it, do you, jb. Where did I write ALL, though?

How dare I make sweeping generalizations when you all do it so frequently regarding liberals and “‘blacks’ who play the ‘race’ and ‘victim’ card, want ‘freebies’ and ‘handouts’ and know nothing about ‘personal responsibility’” and get away with it because you all don’t hold each other accountable for the greasy things you write on the blogs.

But wait, why SHOULDN’T you be able to say what you want about others not of your various persuasions? Gotta tell the “truth”, right? Don’t want to be accused of being too “politically correct”, right? Now, if you could just be able to say the “N” word without question, all would be right with the world, wouldn’t it? Gotta get that “truth” out, huh?

But I digress, and I will add that for the segment of conservative believers who DON’T question whether or not liberal Christians are truly saved, they question their relationship with the Messiah and their maturity.

In all fairness though, I kinda get that, because I call into question a lot of things, especially since, as I’ve said BEFORE, how TOO MANY conservative Christians put on their partisan mantle, and you can’t tell whom they truly serve by how they BEHAVE. So they fall under the same scrutiny, in my opinion. You often can’t tell ya’ll from heathens, to be honest.

Trish spoke of liberals affinity for “buzzwords” (which is not untrue, by the way) but why do so many conservative Christians quote Michelle Malkin and Ann Coulter ad nauseum when neither of them have any sort of spiritual heritage or understand the meaning of Calvary? You’re going to ask how I know that, huh? Easy. By their behaviors that’s how. And not just the “quoting”, but the stank and ugly attitudes of those two, and they are merely a drop in the bucket. I could really go on and on. Too many so-called conservative Christian pundits and bloggers are in the flesh. You can’t tell who they are by what they write, and as such the average Joe and Jane respondent follows right along in these behaviors.

But then ya’ll attack me for pointing them out as if I’m making things up (thousands?, yeah whatever), which is why, in all sincerity, there appears to truly be a more grave issue here, which is that of a spiritual conscience.

Either there are far too many conservative believers with seared consciences, or there is a staggering loss of perspective when presenting our political ideologies in cyberspace.

Defending the indefensible, huh? Bizarre and need to seek help, huh? Okay.

How utterly bizarre. You need to seek help.

PLEASE do not misuse scripture to defend that which is indefensible.

YOU told Trish that she is EXCEPTIONAL among Christians because she does not believe that liberals are not saved. I simply restated what you said and added the corollary that I do not know any Christians who think that one’s political persuasion automatically removes them from salvation.

PLEASE defend the statements that you made, not the ones you may wish that you had made. The truth is that you made sweeping judgments about Christians – yourself, excluded, naturally – and you seem to resent being called on the carpet. At the end of the day, you need to acknowledge what you said.

“Of COURSE sin is not beyond the pale for ANY man. ”
I ask:

WHY NOT?

jb says:

“SIN is the nature of being human. However, in the interest of honesty, YOU stated that virtually ALL Christians claimed that ANY liberal was not saved by simple virtue of the fact that they were liberal.”

I wrote NO such thing, sir. Why you gotta lie on a brotha? C’mon now.

jb says:

“Please be honest enough to debate that which is actually being debated.”

I say:

Okay.

jb:

“You made a sweeping judgment about ALL Christians that went FAR beyond the fact that Christians are sinners, too. ALL real Christians would acknowledge such a fact. however, that is most definitely NOT what you said. PLEASE defend what you said, not your distortion of how someone replied.”

I say:

Show me where I wrote ALL, sir?

Are ALL Christians conservative? In the past 21 years, are ALL the so-called Christians in fellowships, blogs, community forums, mediations, and message boards with whom I’ve engaged CONSERVATIVE?

Now show me my “distortion of how someone replied” and who that someone was, please.

You all love to dog out those of other persuasions and ideologies and won’t hold your own accountable. WRONG is WRONG. And you need to confess it.

Proverbs 30:

5. Every Word of Eloah is tried; He is a shield to those taking refuge in Him.

6. Do not add to His Words,Lest He reprove you, and you be found a liar

What I’ve been talking to you all about are SPIRITUAL matters, which is what you’ve been resisting since the giddy-up!

I don’t care whether or not you believe a single thing I say about what I’VE heard and seen because Father Yahweh sees ALL.

What you all refuse to acknowledge as so called-Christians is that certain behaviors (and not the pet ones like homosexuality and abortion and other “political” sins) are WRONG.

If that man in Florida actually shot and killed Senator Obama, I would dare you to say he was wrong!

But what you do is let them slide if they are done by people of your persuasion or people who you like.

Now I AM going to talk about you all. Phonies make a mockery of the blood that was shed by the sin of variance and favoritism and you WONDER why you get accused of so many funky things.

James 2

8. If you truly accomplish the sovereign law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbour as yourself,” you do well

9. but if you show partiality, you commit sin, being found guilty by the Law as transgressors.

With WHAT and WHOM do you identify FIRST and FOREMOST?

Jb says:

“The assumptive nature of your comments is more than somewhat stunning and more than slightly laughable. It is almost as if you reserve for yourself the validity to make sweeping judgements about entire groups of folks, as if somehow, the sum total of your experiences is more valid than the sum total of my experiences or those of others. I say….hogwash.”

Now who is making assumptions here? I’m going to speak from what I know and have observed over time in a myriad of venues.

How can my observations be “assumptions”, sir?

And moreover, what can you do about them, but to say these observations are “hogwash”?

It’s okay to say that they are hogwash, you know?

Of COURSE sin is not beyond the pale for ANY man. SIN is the nature of being human. However, in the interest of honesty, YOU stated that virtually ALL Christians claimed that ANY liberal was not saved by simple virtue of the fact that they were liberal.

Please be honest enough to debate that which is actually being debated.

You made a sweeping judgment about ALL Christians that went FAR beyond the fact that Christians are sinners, too. ALL real Christians would acknowledge such a fact. however, that is most definitely NOT what you said. PLEASE defend what you said, not your distortion of how someone replied.

The assumptive nature of your comments is more than somewhat stunning and more than slightly laughable. It is almost as if you reserve for yourself the validity to make sweeping judgements about entire groups of folks, as if somehow, the sum total of your experiences is more valid than the sum total of my experiences or those of others. I say….hogwash.

With bare knuckle partisan politics being the new sect of contemporary Christianity, it’s all fair game.

Is this lack of virtue beyond the pale for conservative Christians, jb? Is it THAT hard to believe?

You may be a so-called Christian who mainly participates on secular partisan blogs, and as such may gloss over the absurd statements made by conservative Christians regarding their fellow man of different persuasions and ideologies.

But I’ve been sent and frequented 100′s of forums (in and out of cyberspace) and I’ve seen it.

What you might consider absurd, your fellow conservative Christians consider “truth that isn’t always pretty”.

People THINK they are good..

Just curious about the rest of the crowd…Have the rest of you read unrelenting numbers of comments [thousands, no less] by conservative Christians stating that liberal Christians were NOT saved simply because they were liberals? As the Christians that I know believe that salvation is predicated on one’s belief in Christ as the Way, the Truth, and the Life, I am just trying to figure out whether I am in a parallel universe. As I spend a LOT of time in the cybersphere, I am wondering how I could have simply overlooked the comments by Christians stating that liberals automatically go to hell.

So, what say y’all?

Have any of the rest of you read [over a thousand times, no less] statements by conservative Christians who believe that liberal Christians are not saved solely by virtue of the fact that such Christians are liberals????

As I have NEVER heard a Christian make such an absurd statement, I was wondering if such a view can even be remotely mainstream. Generally, among Christians that I have encountered, the prevailing view is that salvation has more to do with whether one embraces Christ as their Lord and Savior than one’s political persuasion. While BIGDODDY seems to believe that he is an exception among men for realizing that liberals have access to salvation, most Christians I have encountered accept this as a baseline.

It’s the same midset that got Marion Barry re-elected. Ethics just do not matter to some constituents.